Complaint Review: Primerica - Nationwide

I can't believe that you actually believe all that stuff. Do some actual research, don't let PFS spoon feed you the information and not check everything out yourself. I was there. I let them do that to me and now I am embarrassed to admit that I didn't research it myself. I was told, "Don't pay any attention to all the stuff people say it will only put negative thoughts in your head!" Well, I decided I'd better check it out myself and when I discovered that a lot of the stuff was a "little" on the misleading side I researched other companies. It didn't put negative thoughts in my head my research put positive thoughts in my head. I made a change and now I'm doing the SAME thing I did at Primerica, in other words, BTID. Better products for my clients and better compensation for me and believe it or not I'm not constantly fighting the "Oh, your with Primerica, no thanks, I won't do business with you." Someone once said, "I would rather have a mind opened by wonder than one closed by belief."

Rebutal to If Primerica would be upfront and honest with people when they are recruiting they wouldn't have people so unhappy with them I will be glad to explain why people decide to quit Primerica. They fall into one of the many groups below: 1. They talk to someone that supposed to love them, but inreality are afraid of them succeeding in the world and makes them have to change. These are the friends and relatives that say they will never will succeed at Primerica because no one does. They are wrong. Proof is that there are more millionaires this year than before, so the system does work. 2. They Know someone that did not succeed. Success is an individual thing. It is not the fault of the Company if you fail, but it is up to the individual. SInce the Country has become a victim society, we need to blame someone for our not succeeding. If the society took a clear look at itself we would Have less victims and more success stories. But then our kids would have to compete, and maybe not get on the team. 3. They are told that MLM do not work. If one needs to see how this is untrue, just look at any company in the world. You have the owner/CEO making the most money, off the work of the employees, The next level makes money off the sales of the employuees. This goes down to the lowly employees that makes the sale and helps the customer. They are recruited and trained by those above them. That is a MLM. The only difference between this and a company, is that if someone hurts their downline, it hurts themselves. Unless the Company needs that employee, they can fire or layoff you at anytime. But to answer Sue from Dallas TX post about the opportunity, let us examine this post. PFS does offer an iunique opportunity, becasue those several companies that teach teh insuracne business on a parttime basis, charge you for everything. It has been posted on NML watchboard that they make $10,000 to $12,000 working full-time. But then We are not insuranccne salespeople but we help people get out of Debt and retire with dignity. As for Smart Loans, Since we plan it to the persons last loan, and not to be refinanced in 2.75 years the posts statemetns about high fees and prepayment penalties are absurd. As for the simple interest loans most will not do that unless you pay a fee for it. I have seen this in other loans that we have competed against and won. They might be true about the Financial needs analysis being free by anyone, but then they are not from a big company. It is Dave's Financial Services, but they will not cover and do the same things that we do. And then they are usually only done if the client has already made the person money. ANd what about the free updates. It is not the recruiting since we have more disclosures than an employee contract, but then if you read it you would know that. But since you missed this you mighat have missed many things about PFS. Here are some: 1. We give people options when they refy, and show them how to get out of debt faster. 2. We show them how to use the extra money from a refy to save more for retirement. 3. Our Business is encouraged by Social Security. If you need proof, check out your next Annual statement. It says you need to save more than what is SS. And who is doing that to middle america? Not Met Life nor State Farm, nor Schwab, or Smith Barney.

look at their business cards. Name and adress bunch of phone numbers and voila, the E-mail address. www.primerica.com/hisname. that address when it comes back to you, it already installed a very powerful spyware. DO NOT EVEN access any emails or IMs from your friend if she/he works there. keep yoursdelf off from their dirty and filthy operations. it is not worthed.

PFS does not offer a unique opportunity. There are several other companies out there where you can learn the insurance business on a part time basis and get a "spread" on agents you bring in. By the way, those companies do "what's right" for the consumer 100% of time because they have the products to back it up. There are many loans out there that are just as good as SMART loans without high interest rates, excessive charges, and prepayment penalties. Other loans are simple interest. Primerica's propaganda works very well on people that don't take the time to research the products. Primerica is NOT the only company that does a free needs analysis. To be fair, the industry as a whole does have a high turnover rate but nobody else has a 100% turnover rate. If Primerica would be upfront and honest with people when they are recruited they wouldn't have people so unhappy with them.

The first issue is the "dismissed with prejudice" comment he made about the lawsuit I filed against him for slander, harassment, and copyright violation. I agreed voluntarily to the dismissal in light of Ken Young entering into a contractual relationship with me. Mr. Young is in violation of that agreement by posting here and elsewhere on the net. In fact, within a day of the dismissal being signed, Mr. Young violated the agreement and returned to his slanderous and harassing postings. Mr. Young would like you to believe the dismissal was given after evidence was given in the case. This is not so. No evidence was given. The case didn't get beyond the pre-trial conference and no evidence was heard in the matter. Given that I wanted to be reasonable and that I trusted Ken Young's lawyer when he offered me a settlement, I agreed to voluntarily dismiss my suit. I was also in school at the time, and representing myself in a case in Texas proved to be very disruptive to my life. This generosity has proven to be a very big mistake which I intend to rectify through further court action. Ken Young has not only violated my copyrights, but has stolen the work of attorney Karl Magnus and claimed it as his own. In fact, Young does no research on his own, and relies on others to do his work for him. Part of his obvious malicious hatred towards me stems from the fact that I no longer do his research for him, and he has not found anyone with my skills and ability able to do it. Mr. Young is well-known to the courts and to the industry. His jail sentence for criminal and civil contempt is a well-known fact. In sworn testimony, he has admitted to being a consultant to lawyers. In fact, I feel quite confident that he is not telling the truth when he states that he does what he does for free. According to court documents, he has made thousands of dollars going around the country testifying against Prudential. There is no doubt in my mind that his current motivation is money. Ken Young has admitted to misrepresenting life insurance products when working for Prudential. He claims to be an insurance expert, but also claims he did know he was breaking State regulations. It seems to me an "insurance expert" would know when he was violating insurance laws. Clearly, Mr. Young's feigned ignorance was intended to save face in front of the judge. It's also well-known that he mislead plaintiffs in the PRU class-action lawsuit, and deprived them of justice. It is well-known that he compromised their legal position by testifying for money, and by unduly influencing witnesses. It's also well-known that Mr. Young has set up a number of message boards which he uses to gather and abuse the personal information of others. In fact, I would not be writing this if he hadn't done the same to me. He has illegally obtained a person's Social Security Number and driver's license number, and posted it to the net, seemingly hoping someone would use that information to hurt his target. He has also tracked down a user named Eric and harassed him and his superiors at work, attempting to get Eric fired. Mr. Young refers to my having sold a report I prepared on an insurance company. This is true. I sold one report, and was offering my services as a researcher to the public. I am qualified to do so. I have a Bachelor's degree in English literature and I'm working towards a paralegal certificate. I have a 3.9 grade point average in my current studies. What Young omits is that the money I raised from those sales was used to support the education of a parentless student in Eritrea, East Africa. In negotiation during the lawsuit I filed against him, Mr. Young saw the documents supporting this, and yet he continues to mislead the public on this website. There is much more to know about this Ken Young person. There are at least two websites started by people who have been his victims. One is http://b4.boards2go.com/boards/board.cgi?user=truthserve and the other is http://forum.onecenter.com/pfstest/ Lastly, I want to mention that these types of untrue attacks have been posted to many websites by Mr.Young and have resulted in him being banned, kicked off the server, or in having his posts monitored for content. These ISPs and message boards are: BOARDHOST: kicked off for TOS violations. GUESTBOOK.DE: two messages boards closed for TOS violation. BRAVENET: the owner of BRAVENET was threatened and badgered into making a deal with YOUNG allowing his website to stay, but his message board was removed. www.100Insurers: Young's posts are monitored for slanderous content before being posted. www.deferred.com: Young's posts are monitored for slanderous content. www.1000agents.com: Young's posts are monitored for slanderous content. Financial Planning Interactive: After verbally abusing a certified financial planner on this board, Young was run off on a rail. Everyone online who has had any contact with Ken Young agrees that he is malicious, dishonest, and unethical. Many believe he is unstable, and his behavior certainly suggests this possibility. Given the court documents that have surfaced regarding his incarceration and his involvement with Prudential, and having entered into a contractual agreement with him, it's clear that he has no respect for the promises he makes to others, no respect for people's privacy, and no respect for the truth. Insofar as the internet can be used as a tool of hatred, contempt, and abuse of other people, Ken Young has used it for that purpose. My feeling is that his messages here should be removed since they are simply a continuation of his contemptuous attitude, and they are false and harassing. Since the lawsuit, Young has attempted to protect himself by not naming names in his false and harassing posts. That really shouldn't matter. The content is false, malicious, contemptuous, and without merit, and doesn't deserve to be on this site.

The information I have been bringing to the public free of costs to them over the Internet I perform as a public service at my own personal costs. Those persons who have been adversely effected by the false, misleading and deceptive inducement orchestrations yammered by the generally uninformed agents of the Primerica Sales Division have overhelmingly accepted the proven method I developed twenty-years ago. Those agents of the PFS Sales division who use those deceptive orchestation inducements do so for a purpose of enticing consumers into engaging in a business relationship with Primerica through their Sales Division. My publications and me personally have two types of adversaries. The first type of adversary quite naturally is the PFS uninformed agent who uses those same deceptive inducement orchestration because by debunking them it will either cost them a commission and/or a recruit to join the organization. The second type of adversary of my publications and also me are those former PFSers and/or non-PFSers who hurl disparaging comments and epithets at me who are busily engaged in attempt to build a business either selling public information in a package form found on the interent and/or who are attempting to build a consulting business through obtaining the names and addresses of those persons who post to these types of boards then for a consulting fee turn the names over to any attorney who will represent a PFS victim in a lawsuit. One of these types of adversaries only was licensed with Primerica for a period of eight (8) months then left the industry altogether never to return. He has falsely led those who visit his publications and read his postings on other message boards that the period of time he spent withing the industry was much longer than that suggesting consumers puchase his packaged material. Then we have another adversary who had been fired from two positions with different insurance companies and when he went Independent he failed for the third time. In fact, in his second position as an agent for a major financial services company he was placed on probation and then after three months terminated for no other reason than his new business commissions had dropped down to a low of $8.77 a week for the next thirteen week pay quarter. He has introduced himself to internet user consumers not only as a qualified insurance advisor, but also to attorney's as an "Expert source of litigation information. I have exposed and debunked both of these adversaries because the issue of helping a Primerica victim is too important of an issue then for them to misrepresent themselves to consumers needing qualified help just because they want to pound their own chests. One of them has even ititiated litigation against me representing himself in court Pro Se. The judge signed an order dismissing his case "with prejudice". The other adversary was determined to have absolutely no financial depth worth initiating litigation against him for his libel and defamation especially when it was uncover he had $60,000 dollars of Federal Tax Liens already recorded in public record against him. My publications are presently being innundated by viruses. Presently the is in progrees an invetigation being conducted by the FBI based upon a complaint I filed. Both of those adversary's names and addresses have been provided to the FBI as the prime culprits in sending he viruses. To best explain my posture I believe what I am about to enlighten you of best fits my posture. Back in the late 1980's at a National PFS (then A.L. Williams convention being held in Los Angeles, on an overhead screen Located in the Los Angeles Colluseum they played a video tape depicting me being blown up in effigy by a case of dynamite. I understand that everyone attending stood up and cheered. This made me very happy to hear strange at it may be, because then I knew that everyone there attending had been effected by the work I am involved in. If everyone turned to each other and mumbled, "what's that all about", I would have been very sad thiking that possibly the free work I had been involved in was to no avail. Therefore, the more negative comments I hear about or see for myself posted onto the Internet the more I know that my work of exposing and debunking Charlatans especially those PFS agents who would knowingly and intentionally mislead and deceive the publice through the use of those false, misleading and deceptive inducement orchestrations, the more satisfaction I receive then kowing my efforts time have not been waisted. Keep posting those negative comments directed at me and my publications to this forum folks, they bring me much joy and satisfaction by you confirming that you PFSers couldn't even get your foot in the front door of a consumer if it wasn't for your false, misleading and deceptive inducement orcherstrations. As for those two non-PFSer adversaries, the more they fruitlessly attempt to run my publications off the Internet by defaming and libeling me and the publications I sponsor. the more I recogninze that the free unadvertised publications I sponsor are eating into your business in you inability to sell the information I bring to the public free. By the way, we must being doing something right with my publications just as this publication is doing because in both 2002 and 2003, google.com chose and listed the website I sponsor as the number #1 publication on the Internet in its category on the google.com directory.

It would appear after reading comments made by Kenneth Young that he is in need of help. Once upon a time he was in the spotlight "fighting" ALW. He made money selling books about how to combat replacement. Problem is that he worked for one of the worst companies for sales practice problems, Prudential! I understand that many who know of him also know of his poor sales practices and unethical sales representations. PFS is not the kind of place that I would ever represent or do business with as a client. The people at the top of the heap reap the rewards when people get through their 30 to 40 people on their contact list. The business becomes the property of the upline, not unlike AFLAC and their crummy vesting and commission payouts. The header of this message says it best. Kenneth Young can't spell or do anything of value. He just rants about what used to be. Consider that he lies about fines and has been the subject of a criminal investigation more that one time. PFS = NO Kenneth Young = DON"T WASTE YOUR TIME

Overlooked and side stepped are the basics of all successful business models, top light and bottom heavy models with fat middles maintaining a constant reinforcement through recruitment. Whether you are employed by government or private industry you and those who would compete with you for the same positions are recruited from career day at high school or college to a periodical publication displaying "Help Wanted". Whether your building a car, an army, or a nation, recruiting individuals already trained or willing to be trained to meet the goal is the most effective way. The training is generally type specific and commonly done in a public forum. We call it school. In most if not all public schools there are individuals with degrees who actually believe they can determine ones vocational future. What is not known to the new recruit is all of his or her education from the time he or she entered kindergarten has been designed to incorporate him or her into the work force at the same socio-economic level he or she entered school. This can be observed by the financial support the school receives in comparison to the economic level of the community supporting the school. While the innocent is exposed to glimpses of the "American Dream", he or she is trained to be nothing more than a worker. Little if no entrepreneurial training evidences this. Now the dilemma! While most would succumb to this mediocre existence, letting what little ambition they have, fade, there is an above average group who will not settle until their goals and dreams are met. Some enter post secondary institutions we call colleges and universities to obtain accreditation, in order to obtain higher paying positions in these same work environments they were originally programmed for. Others after attending a college or a university come to understand, for them, the college experience absorbs valuable time they could use to pursue their ultimate goal. Finally, the last group is those who have a spark within them, knowing if given the opportunity, they could do something extraordinary, but due to academic or financial shortfalls, they are in most instances eliminated from the opportunity to do something outstanding. For the mediocre, they will continue to fill the working void as openings come available. However due to technology, openings are growing less and less with an ever growing and longer living population. Those who pursued higher education will go on to supervise, manage and oversee the mediocre. These two groups have the security of their salary representing the positions they hold, no matter how much or how little effort they exhibit; they will only get paid for their position as determined by their bosses. The last two groups are the components of an army waiting for something. Searching for what, they do not know! A new way to bring products and services to the marketplace has developed and is mutating into many variances. Some will even take its core model, the pyramid, the geometric structure of all government, business, and religious organizations and use it for unscrupulous gain; a get rich quick scheme, receiving money in exchange for no product or service. Meanwhile the remainder of this group understand the core concepts and used wisely, all can benefit. Will all benefit? No, but all can benefit. The key component is work ethic. Now the individual can be paid on his or her work effort. The producers of these products and services benefit from low cost advertising and the goodwill the new entrepreneur has in his or her community. This is beginning of network marketing. The new entrepreneur does not want to be a salesman forever. Salesman burnout. They just do. They wear out just like shoes. So where is the opportunity? Introduce multilevel marketing; a concept adopted from the same geometric structure, the pyramid. A percentage of the larger number of peoples efforts directly benefit a smaller number of people. This commonly referred to as bonuses shared by middle and upper management of traditional companies. Taking this concept and sharing its opportunity with each of the entrepreneurs continually in the form of residuals or overrides, instead of annually, creates a new incentive for achievement and boosts production for the company at large and at the same time allows the new business owner to create a retirement income. In every industry, there are trade secrets. Such secrets, if revealed in the marketplace would change the balance of bargaining power in the trading place. For example, a car is made up of die cast metals and plastics. Once the dies and casts are created, they are reused and reused. This how parts from like cars are interchangeable. Does anybody really know how much it costs to create a car? To the consumer, it costs tens of thousands of dollars to purchase. Another example is the telecommunication industry. When H. Brian Thompson revealed six second billing (as opposed to the traditional rounded up to the nearest minute billing) to the public as the new head of LCI after leaving MCI, the major telephone companies in the United States had to change its billing practices to compete. This was LCIs edge in its marketplace, revealing abusive trade secrets. It was a call to ethics, and it worked. The current US economy, for all its advances, has a remarkable number of underprivileged and underserved. This is the latter part of that last group. The population at large is living longer giving rise to a growing elderly population. Families are having children later in life and the theme in the country is buy now pay later. These same companies which used to employ entire communities are examining ways to increase their profit margin. The result is the human element in the work place is expendable. Government knows it will not be able to support an elderly population in the years to come and has scrambled to adopt new legislation to promote retirement planning among the mediocre-a practice only previously done by the above average. With less children in the generations, baby boomers realize there will be no one to see to their retirement needs. In the midst of all of this there has been an industry that has continually serve the better interest of one segment of the population while victimizing the other. Financial institutions have worked to meet the financial planning needs of six figure earners, with the promise of big commissions and continually fed their overpriced, hidden cost vehicles to a population who would ultimately die paying for it. Their heirs would receive little if any benefit, only to be recycled into the same pay until death experience. These vehicles were sold with the promise of education and retirement savings. The victims were never told they had to live to be some outlandish age to collect retirement monies, monies that had little value due to inflation. The alternatives was to surrender the vehicle and loose its provision or just die, and maybe your family can do something with it before one of their licensed professionals would return to build new commissions on the ignorance inherited with the death benefit. The horror is the victim is your parent, grandparent, aunt, uncle, and even you. Yes even me; All because of industry secrets. The combinations of all of these things made the perfect foundation and the perfect building blocks for a company born in integrity and raised in doing what is right! Doing what is right each and every time. A.L. Williams Company now known as Primerica is that company. The testimony is the fruits of the company. How many families have they save from poverty? How many individuals have they taken to six figure and seven figure incomes. Primerica has over six million clients in Canada and the US and over 100,000 representatives around the world. 26 years in business! Federally regulated! And is responsible for 60% of all revenue among the Citigroup companies. They have to be doing whats right, by showing families in mainstream communities to by low cost term and invest the difference. When 911 occurred, National Benefit Life delivered on its policies, instead of jumping into the finger pointing line of other producers. Finally, Where can you go and pay under two hundred dollars and become an owner in the Number One Financial Services on the planet. Not stockownership; real hands on business ownership, licensed and certified in the state of your residence. All you have to do is show up, just like you do at work, be coachable, and in the words of Robert Kirosaki, the author of Rich Dad, Poor Dad, mind your own business. There is no better, respectable, integrity base opportunity for all who would meet the call, The call to live ones dreams; The call to being outstanding..

I agree with the sizing up of Ken Young. Some people don't know this, but it is an absolute demonstration of the depths to which this person will sink. Now, I also agree that Primerica presents a statistically poor opportunity to an enthusiastic public. But I prefer when facts are presented to the public, and people use their brains to come up with a decision. Unfortunately, Ken runs a message board that, in his words, "fights fire with fire". OK, it's a bit of a cliche, but think about it. Ken attempts to fight false, misleading, and deceptive recruiting, and so on....how? Well, by being false, misleading and deceptive. The most flagrant abuse that Ken has produced to date, in my opinion, is a statement he made a while back. While trying to convince a poster to get a refund from Primerica, he said that the company has a lot of ethical and operational problems. So bad in fact, that they were fined $20 million by a regulatory agency. Twenty million dollars is not exactly pocket change. Chances are good the reader reversed his or her decision based on that fact. Small problem, thought. There was no such fine. When confronted with this obvious, blatant misprepresentation by a self-proclaimed expert, Ken said he read the article in a reputable publication somewhere. Of course, it was asked what publication, because the entire civilized world was unaware of such a fine. Ken never produced the article, nor what publication it was in. The viewers were supposed to take his word on it. In fact, if you want to see it, it is fact that Ken will show you *if* you pay twenty-five thousand dollars. That is a fact. It's a common tactic used by Young to stonewall anybody who needs proof of his wild accusations. He will offer proof, but only if the user puts up twenty-five thousand dollars. If Young offers the proof, they lose their money. If for some reason he can't produce it, you get his $25,000. Who in their right mind would put up $25,000 with a person who has been known to have trouble with reality? In the meantime, it has been researched, and the reality shows that Primerica was never given a $20M fine. You can search the website of the agency that Ken claims fined them. They have a function which lets you search for such fines. This is obviously not good enough for him. He definitely doesn't let truth stand in the way of his crusade. On a well-respected financial planners' forum, Ken asked a question and had some out-of-date information. No big deal. But when a regular poster to the forum corrected him, by referring Ken to an IRS publication, Ken went ballistic, calling this person a "charlatan", a "fraud", and an "idiot". Simply for giving him documentation! This is a fact as well. Read the original thread, preserved for all to see: http://www.financial-planning.com/wwwboard13/messages/1193.html Ken later said on another forum that his information was out of date. He never said why he called this person those horrible names without provocation. As you can see, he was asked to leave the forum. It is a matter of principle. You don't fight lies with lies. You fight lies with truth. You don't fight deception with deception. You fight deception with honesty and full disclosure. Make your decision based on facts. But please, be careful where your facts come from.

First issue. I have never been a Primerica agent as many of the sponsors of similar message boards and websites boards that parrot my publications have been. Next issue. The bone I have to pick with the PFS Sales Division surrounds their false, misleading and deceptive sales, marketing, replacement of in-force existing life insurance, their limited knowledge of the mechanics of life insurance products, refinancing of mortgages, mutual funds and their recruiting activities they orchestrate as inducements to entice the public into engaging into a business relationship with the company. The internal structure of the company, i.e a MLM Company and Pyramid commission schedules and so on is their concern, not mine. When it comes down to the company's products, if they were stripped of their false, misleading and deceptive inducement orchestrations their products would have a tinkers chance of competing in the market place and the company in my view would self-destruct unless they reduce their premium charges and administration costs in order to compete in the field. If you want to continue to lose your clients to them then go forward and show your clients the problems that Primerica and Citigroup are having with the Regulators and then watch them pull out of their little bag of goodies the same type of similar problems possibly even your company has also been involved in with the Regulators and in the courts also. I am dedicated to forcing the company to compete in the field without all of that carrot dangling to join the organization and deceitfull inducement orchestrations they are using as a smoke screen to entice the public into engaging into a business relationship with them. They are dealing with me and not you because it is obvious in my publications I have hit the nerve of what generates business for them. Without any strings attached to my intent such as building a consulting business to attorneys or selling to you people public information to gain financial remuneration for myself so you can conserve your clients, I am finally working with them for these needed orchestrated inducement changes. Regardless of what you have to say my work will go on until I am satisfied that just as any other company has to do, they will compete in the field without the use of them. Not one of you who have bashed me can match what I have already given to the profession that was very good to me and my family. Not one of you have any type of a track record of standing up like a man and faced them off in a courtroom and prevailed. Not one of you have ever performed anything of value to influence changes in their inducement presentations and that is all that counts. Yes, working behind the scenes we have a start with the in-house memorandum that was generated and singed on May 21, 2003 surrounding the alleged "Christian Company" inducement that possibly even cause some of you the loss of a client. Now it is the six-figure income issue rhetoric that they spew to the public also. It sure looks like that the ration of total field force who are earning that six-figure income inducement will once again be viewed on the company's own Home Office Website for all to see that also can be used by you to save a client who may be anticipating joining the organization and replacing the in-force policy you may have even written. I can expect the PFS agents who yammer their "Bruhaha" on the Internet they direct at me because they are personally experiencing the pain my publications cause to them. When I am on the Interent helping the professional agents retain their clients and a small handfull of you who some were former turncoat PFSers once themselves ripping the public off with these same deceiving inducements attempt to lessen the effect of my work so they can gain some notoriety for themselves once in their lives and build a Anti-PFS board just to retailiate against the company using the public for your own personal gains without any feeling for the public yourselves so you bash me and then attempt to take credit for my accomplishments yourselves, all you are doing is demonstrating to me that you are no different than the PFSers themselves, now attempting to wear a mask of respectibility. I see know reason why I have a need to post any further rebuttals to your nonsense. I will continue to do what I have been doing and anything negative you post about me hear will as usual have absolutely no adverse effect on my work. I will continue to work with the PFS Home Office for the changes in their presentations I am wanting, attorneys suing Primerica on behalf of client victims will continue to contact me wanting me to act in the capacity of their Expert Fraud Consultant but I will not accept the duty but refer them to other qualified Expert Consultants, I will continue to give Regulators that contact me asking for my input. So, the bottom line is, you continue to do your thing and I will do mine without any further regard to what you have to post here or in fact, any other place. By the way Jaxxx, your informer was wrong. I was not in the Island Itl. wearing black pants and a black flowered shirt this evening, but the hurricane plywood lumber shutters that guy from Oklahoma who drives the dark blue Chevy staying at Richard's house has finished hammering them into the stucco and they are all up now. When is Richard going to move that tacky plastic cheap lawn furniture off of his front yard? Afterall, we wouldn't want are neighborhood to start looking like the poor section of Victoria British Columbia you know. I understand that the guy who drinks at 2-Seas Bar was seen again there this week t

As much as I feel Primerica runs a poor business model and offers an even poorer opportunity, the previous poster has no right to attack it. Ken Young was singularly responsible for the astronomical growth of A.L. Williams. He is very proud of his lawsuit, where he won whas is commonly termed "shut-up" money in the amount of a measly $75,000. But the publicity generated by his 'windfall' propelled the company to unbelievable new growth. For a long time, the A.L. Williams "crusade" focused on whole life insurance and the industry that mislead the public into purchasing insurance as an investment vehicle. Young is proud to admit that they burned an effigy of him at a convention a couple decades ago. What really happened was, they finally were able to attach a name and face to the anonymous "whole life agent" that up until that they were crusading against. Basically Ken served as a rallying point, giving them a renewed energy, because they now knew they type of person they were fighting. And it worked. Over the next two decades, the organization grew to new heights, in in-force, sales, and field force. Ken is now yammering that he caused Primerica to issue a memorandum, saying it is not a "christian organization". Here's the deal: Primerica NEVER said that. That was never part of any official company mantra, script, or sales technique. It would be crazy to do so! What probably happened was, individual RVP's, or base shops, said they followed Christian principles. For example, some might close on Sunday. Ken seems to have found issue with this, and his mind projected the actions of some RVPs onto a company-wide demon that he felt obligated to attack. Basically, the memorandum tells the field force to avoid doing something which was never even done before. It's like a company issuing a memo asking employees to avoid walking on their heads at work. It simply was not, and is not, a widespread problem. The letter is most likely there to shut him up. This whole business about people launching some sort of war against him is totally insane. I'll leave it for you to discover the truth behind him, but take the insane-sounding ramblings for what they are. Thank you.

Where were my critics twenty-two years ago when I was bringing to the attention of the public the "rip-off" in progress when Primerica was known as the A.L. Williams Company and the insuring company was known as MILICO? Those who remember were attempting to save their in-force insurance and their clients from replacement using a comparison of policy products but to no avail. When Williams and MILICO initiated their lawsuit to enjoin the training manual I had authored to stop the improper replacement of insurance and debunk the false, misleading and deceptive inducement orchestrations to get their feet into the doors of consumers, you were burrying your heads not knowing what to do and letting me fight your battles for you. If it wasn't for the efforts like people like me, i.e. Allen Press and Julian Love, my critics would all be selling only term life insurance today. Did any of you author any articles on your feelings on the matter and send them in to the Association monthly publication? Did any of you go on tour to train any of your peers how to combat the A.L. Williams organization? Did any of you devise a better method of resisting the replacement attempts of the A.L. Williams (now Primerica) Company? No, you sat there shaking in your boots hoping that the problem would go away and not effect you personally, and you didn't give a hoot about those professional agents who were being adversely effected. So along comes the rebirth of the PFS Sales Division and you go back to the same method you used before that being, show some publications to your clients surrounding the regulartory problems the company has been involved in together with attempting to save your case by comparing products. Did you ever post anything on the Internet about under their products and belief a consumer would be self insuring with their own money when the temporary term life insurance expired? "No is the answer to that also. So now we have a handful of ex-PFS who have failed at Primerica themselves wanting to retailiate against the organization and a couple of them wanting to once in their lives gain some spotlight for themselves while at the same time earning a few bucks as consultants and selling the public information that I give away free through my website and message board who devise a scheme to take the information that I originated and take credit for themselves as doing so without giving credit where credit is due. Too boot, because both regulatiors and attorneys are seeking my input and not theirs, they devise a scheme to discredit me to draw attention to themselves even to boasting that they have joined hands with each other to declare a "kenwars" against me announcing on the Internet they are going to run me off the Internet together with my website and message boards. Ask yourself this. How come out of the blue a directive has been sent to the PFS RVPs clearing up the matter of the false, misleading and deceptive orchestration inducement that allegedly Primerica is a "Christian Organization", so they yammer as an enticement. Did my critics have anything to do with that? The answer is "No". The Primerica h*o and I hammered that deal out for a trade in once of my website documents to be altered. Next you are once again are going to see the statistics of the percentage of the total PFS field force who reach that six-figure income being made available for public viewing again which I just leaned from the PFS h*o this week will soon be published in their website. Did any of my critics have anything to do with that? "No" they did not, but I did working behind the scenes with the Primerica Home Office. Next on the agenda that I have been grieving about for twenty-plus years you can expect to find a statement as to the any alleged ownership in the organization and building your alleged own business which I am also working on behind the scenes with the PFS h*o. Just as I did twenty-plus years ago in debunking their agent's false, misleading and deceptive inducement orchestrations, I will not be intimidated into discontinuing my free work until each and every false, misleading and deceptive inducement orchestration is debunked by their h*o reduced to a written statement. That is my mission and regardless of how they fruitlessly attemtp to thwart my mission I began twenty-years ago, my critics attempts to do so will prove to be fruitless to them. I can understand why I have approximately 100,000 PFSers working against me, but when the small handful of Ken Young bashers who state that they are on the same side of the fence as I am work against me in the common cause just so they can gain some notoriety in the industry by foolishly attempting to remove me from the sceen while at the same time earning a few extra bucks for themselves, then they are nothing more than a modern day Benedict Arnold who would sell their own family down the river to better themselves. Shame on them for what they have attempted to do while at the same time one has attemtped twice to steal my message board, an attempt has been made to alter a document illustrated on my website posting it to his own taking credit for originating the document, a couple have attempted to spread viruses to my computer, one has even brought his family into his "kenwars" declared war to stalk me in the location I live, one has stacked lies upon lies about himself presenting himself as a person who is able to properly perform in my place and so on and so on. One is so nutsy that his plan to take over through force instead of earning what he is seeking even telephoned me one evening eight times at 1:00AM in the morning to harass me out of his frustration of his plan not working for him. What those critics of mine can't seem to get through their skull is, if I took on A.L. Williams group in litigation and prevailed in an out of court settlement, and I was the first to testify infront of the Florida Attorney General and the Florida DOI to help right a terrible wrong being perpetrated by the Pru and I prevailed in that issue, then what makes them think that I will cave into them? When the PFS Sales Division ceases to use ALL of those false, misleading and deceptive inducement orchestrations they are trained in the use of, then my mission will be completed, and then and only then will I remove myself from the spotlight and turn over my work to monitor them to someone else who is qualified to keep them in compliance with State Statutes like we all have to do i.e., playing by the rules. The only place for PFS to settle the issue or who retains the client is in the open competitive market place with product pricing which as of this date doesn't even qualify Primerica to compete.

When they are confronted with issues or questions, instead of answering them honestly, intelligently, or with any sort of structure, they resort to any method necessary (ie responding with another question, using an anecdote, vagueness, and total avoidance) to completely absolve themselves of dealing with the truth. I think this serves two purposes: 1. To acheive the obvious goal - close the deal; And 2. It is a mechanism of denial. What a sad way to live. Many of the responses also make references to "corporate" employment. This is particularly interesting, since most of the questions or anecdotes dealing with it are presented by people who obviously wouldn't be qualified to work in the mail-rooms of corporate America. It is also a lousy tactic. When you want to argue the strengths of your company there is no benefit to compare or contrast it to something different - that's what they call a "reductionist" argument. As for the details that have been presented, some of them are valid. But Thos, as its already been pointed out, your idea that you "give up (your) time and talent to train" people, and that you get nothing in return if you don't get their leads is total BS. Without those leads you still get over-rides. I thought the over-ride schedule was your compendsation for your "time and talent". I can see how you would rather get commission on those leads directly, rather than a percentage through over-rides, but you should just be honest and let people know that that is your motive, instead of some lame response that the people you recruit OWE YOU. Especially since, as you stated later in your response, they are the only way you will get to your coveted "RVP" position. Albert, how can I say this to foster your comprehension - the information that is available for exchange between Citibank and Primerica is invaluable. If you don't realize that they exchange client's personal information for "marketing", and profit from it then you are a complete moron. While the sales or trading of personal information is common, it is considered unethical, especially when considered in the capacity that Citigroup uses it - profiting from other's debt. And Walter, if attending 7 o'clock PM meetings to chant "Amen!" for several hours while watching a video tape is "working your own business" then I, and likely most other people, would gladly settle for the alternative (ie anything else). Also, if a recruiter has to "pitch" the job, position, whatever, and uses income figures as part of that pitch, than they should be prepared to give their own - especially when they use their own "success" as a recruitment tool. In other (normal) interview situations, you don't have to ask the recruiter what they make, since it is inconsequential as they provide you with your salary information up front, and you will likely have different responsibilities within the company. I was under the impression that only a basic level of comprehension was required to understand the suggestion made. One thing that I really can't understand is why PFS supporters are under the impression that it is okay to hide the truth when it comes to the interview process. Most interview processes are a constructive effort to find the right person for the right job. As such all RELEVANT information is openly available. And if it isn't available during the interview, it is easily obtained through other means. But with companies like Primerica the goal of the interview process is to basically get as many as possible by any means necessary. The list of questions originally posted here was basically a way of saying "Do you have anything to hide?" and "Why?" Don't get pissed off because you are exposed. The more you try to justify why you withold information, the more suspect you become. PS - learn to write, its slightly important.

When they are confronted with issues or questions, instead of answering them honestly, intelligently, or with any sort of structure, they resort to any method necessary (ie responding with another question, using an anecdote, vagueness, and total avoidance) to completely absolve themselves of dealing with the truth. I think this serves two purposes: 1. To acheive the obvious goal - close the deal; And 2. It is a mechanism of denial. What a sad way to live. Many of the responses also make references to "corporate" employment. This is particularly interesting, since most of the questions or anecdotes dealing with it are presented by people who obviously wouldn't be qualified to work in the mail-rooms of corporate America. It is also a lousy tactic. When you want to argue the strengths of your company there is no benefit to compare or contrast it to something different - that's what they call a "reductionist" argument. As for the details that have been presented, some of them are valid. But Thos, as its already been pointed out, your idea that you "give up (your) time and talent to train" people, and that you get nothing in return if you don't get their leads is total BS. Without those leads you still get over-rides. I thought the over-ride schedule was your compendsation for your "time and talent". I can see how you would rather get commission on those leads directly, rather than a percentage through over-rides, but you should just be honest and let people know that that is your motive, instead of some lame response that the people you recruit OWE YOU. Especially since, as you stated later in your response, they are the only way you will get to your coveted "RVP" position. Albert, how can I say this to foster your comprehension - the information that is available for exchange between Citibank and Primerica is invaluable. If you don't realize that they exchange client's personal information for "marketing", and profit from it then you are a complete moron. While the sales or trading of personal information is common, it is considered unethical, especially when considered in the capacity that Citigroup uses it - profiting from other's debt. And Walter, if attending 7 o'clock PM meetings to chant "Amen!" for several hours while watching a video tape is "working your own business" then I, and likely most other people, would gladly settle for the alternative (ie anything else). Also, if a recruiter has to "pitch" the job, position, whatever, and uses income figures as part of that pitch, than they should be prepared to give their own - especially when they use their own "success" as a recruitment tool. In other (normal) interview situations, you don't have to ask the recruiter what they make, since it is inconsequential as they provide you with your salary information up front, and you will likely have different responsibilities within the company. I was under the impression that only a basic level of comprehension was required to understand the suggestion made. One thing that I really can't understand is why PFS supporters are under the impression that it is okay to hide the truth when it comes to the interview process. Most interview processes are a constructive effort to find the right person for the right job. As such all RELEVANT information is openly available. And if it isn't available during the interview, it is easily obtained through other means. But with companies like Primerica the goal of the interview process is to basically get as many as possible by any means necessary. The list of questions originally posted here was basically a way of saying "Do you have anything to hide?" and "Why?" Don't get pissed off because you are exposed. The more you try to justify why you withold information, the more suspect you become. PS - learn to write, its slightly important.

When they are confronted with issues or questions, instead of answering them honestly, intelligently, or with any sort of structure, they resort to any method necessary (ie responding with another question, using an anecdote, vagueness, and total avoidance) to completely absolve themselves of dealing with the truth. I think this serves two purposes: 1. To acheive the obvious goal - close the deal; And 2. It is a mechanism of denial. What a sad way to live. Many of the responses also make references to "corporate" employment. This is particularly interesting, since most of the questions or anecdotes dealing with it are presented by people who obviously wouldn't be qualified to work in the mail-rooms of corporate America. It is also a lousy tactic. When you want to argue the strengths of your company there is no benefit to compare or contrast it to something different - that's what they call a "reductionist" argument. As for the details that have been presented, some of them are valid. But Thos, as its already been pointed out, your idea that you "give up (your) time and talent to train" people, and that you get nothing in return if you don't get their leads is total BS. Without those leads you still get over-rides. I thought the over-ride schedule was your compendsation for your "time and talent". I can see how you would rather get commission on those leads directly, rather than a percentage through over-rides, but you should just be honest and let people know that that is your motive, instead of some lame response that the people you recruit OWE YOU. Especially since, as you stated later in your response, they are the only way you will get to your coveted "RVP" position. Albert, how can I say this to foster your comprehension - the information that is available for exchange between Citibank and Primerica is invaluable. If you don't realize that they exchange client's personal information for "marketing", and profit from it then you are a complete moron. While the sales or trading of personal information is common, it is considered unethical, especially when considered in the capacity that Citigroup uses it - profiting from other's debt. And Walter, if attending 7 o'clock PM meetings to chant "Amen!" for several hours while watching a video tape is "working your own business" then I, and likely most other people, would gladly settle for the alternative (ie anything else). Also, if a recruiter has to "pitch" the job, position, whatever, and uses income figures as part of that pitch, than they should be prepared to give their own - especially when they use their own "success" as a recruitment tool. In other (normal) interview situations, you don't have to ask the recruiter what they make, since it is inconsequential as they provide you with your salary information up front, and you will likely have different responsibilities within the company. I was under the impression that only a basic level of comprehension was required to understand the suggestion made. One thing that I really can't understand is why PFS supporters are under the impression that it is okay to hide the truth when it comes to the interview process. Most interview processes are a constructive effort to find the right person for the right job. As such all RELEVANT information is openly available. And if it isn't available during the interview, it is easily obtained through other means. But with companies like Primerica the goal of the interview process is to basically get as many as possible by any means necessary. The list of questions originally posted here was basically a way of saying "Do you have anything to hide?" and "Why?" Don't get pissed off because you are exposed. The more you try to justify why you withold information, the more suspect you become. PS - learn to write, its slightly important.

When they are confronted with issues or questions, instead of answering them honestly, intelligently, or with any sort of structure, they resort to any method necessary (ie responding with another question, using an anecdote, vagueness, and total avoidance) to completely absolve themselves of dealing with the truth. I think this serves two purposes: 1. To acheive the obvious goal - close the deal; And 2. It is a mechanism of denial. What a sad way to live. Many of the responses also make references to "corporate" employment. This is particularly interesting, since most of the questions or anecdotes dealing with it are presented by people who obviously wouldn't be qualified to work in the mail-rooms of corporate America. It is also a lousy tactic. When you want to argue the strengths of your company there is no benefit to compare or contrast it to something different - that's what they call a "reductionist" argument. As for the details that have been presented, some of them are valid. But Thos, as its already been pointed out, your idea that you "give up (your) time and talent to train" people, and that you get nothing in return if you don't get their leads is total BS. Without those leads you still get over-rides. I thought the over-ride schedule was your compendsation for your "time and talent". I can see how you would rather get commission on those leads directly, rather than a percentage through over-rides, but you should just be honest and let people know that that is your motive, instead of some lame response that the people you recruit OWE YOU. Especially since, as you stated later in your response, they are the only way you will get to your coveted "RVP" position. Albert, how can I say this to foster your comprehension - the information that is available for exchange between Citibank and Primerica is invaluable. If you don't realize that they exchange client's personal information for "marketing", and profit from it then you are a complete moron. While the sales or trading of personal information is common, it is considered unethical, especially when considered in the capacity that Citigroup uses it - profiting from other's debt. And Walter, if attending 7 o'clock PM meetings to chant "Amen!" for several hours while watching a video tape is "working your own business" then I, and likely most other people, would gladly settle for the alternative (ie anything else). Also, if a recruiter has to "pitch" the job, position, whatever, and uses income figures as part of that pitch, than they should be prepared to give their own - especially when they use their own "success" as a recruitment tool. In other (normal) interview situations, you don't have to ask the recruiter what they make, since it is inconsequential as they provide you with your salary information up front, and you will likely have different responsibilities within the company. I was under the impression that only a basic level of comprehension was required to understand the suggestion made. One thing that I really can't understand is why PFS supporters are under the impression that it is okay to hide the truth when it comes to the interview process. Most interview processes are a constructive effort to find the right person for the right job. As such all RELEVANT information is openly available. And if it isn't available during the interview, it is easily obtained through other means. But with companies like Primerica the goal of the interview process is to basically get as many as possible by any means necessary. The list of questions originally posted here was basically a way of saying "Do you have anything to hide?" and "Why?" Don't get pissed off because you are exposed. The more you try to justify why you withold information, the more suspect you become. PS - learn to write, its slightly important.

When I decided that I would give Primerica a shot I was considering it as a tool for another business that I was starting up with and having financing available printed within my business card I thought would be attractive to generate my own customers. There for I did not believe my recruiter that I could get rich doing there way of recuiting others to generate my income. Its only common sense you are the one who has to apply yourself to generate your own income, maybe your not to good with numbers so take a class that doesn't take up a whole lot of time. I like how people can change the arguement like you can't even spell. Big deal you know what I meant. One of the things I did before making the final decision on the $199.00 course was 1. I will pay the 199 and forget you recruiter if your gonna bank of my friends and relatives. 2. I decided to let them know later, I need to think about it. Also I like to add they wanted to see my list of people I had 30 or more and the recruiter was amazed wih my list of all business owners I knew. He wanted my list before starting anything I told the recruiter sure I will make you a copy for a small fortune. I also had a voice activate recorder on the table in vision of anyone to see but still unnoticed. My reason for that was because I don't always pick up everything said and I analys it later in making my decisions because I have been ripped off and I am sceptical. I don't believe Primerica is a fraud but recruiting and convincing others to do the chain is the most obvious of not getting rich. I would only think any dummy should know that. I thought It would be an extra income for me being that I would be meeting new people everyday thru my own business and I could generate income thru a cut off the commission. All in the end I never did go to school even when I paid the $199 and I still refer all my connection to a refinance company and they reward me with the referral. Networking is a good tool getting to know people and being friendly and offering help and good help will make you rich, even if its in just rich with people you know. I can barder trades and doesn't cost a dime for anyone to get something done Now thats being rich. Ever heard the phrase "I have a friend that can help you out"? Neat tactic it works people pay you back in time. To conclude bummer that you couldn't get rich over night. My age 18!

Albert, Could you please tell me, in what year did Primerica INVENT, (your word) Term Life Insurance? I didn't realize the Primerica has been around that long. I hope you'll answer this question for me, because I haven't formed an opinion yet, one way or another,and I do believe that others would like to know the answer as well. Thank you for your time.

First, I would like to say that any more comments regarding Citibank sending credit card offers to Primerica clients should be met with scorn. I may not be the sharpest knife in the drawer, but even I realize that Primerica has absolutely no control over what Citibank does. Yes, Citigroup is out there to make a profit, and it manages exceedingly well ... The CEO took it from nothing to a $1 Trillion asset company, easily the largest financial services company in the world. Nonetheless, Primerica representatives are consistent in their statements against debt, and are serious when they say their consolidation loan is the last loan ever needed. If one is presented with the question regarding the credit card, the answer is simply: "cut it up." Iteration is necessary here: Primerica doesn't control Citibank. They are two separate companies, both under the umbrella of Citigroup. How can I state this to foster comprehension? How's this: Primerica doesn't profit from a Citibank credit card offer delivered after a SMART loan. Get it? The responses written by Thos were, for the most part, effective rebuttals. They were subsequently misconstrued. While I now am at the mercy of Ken or Kim or PFSWATCH or whoever (note: you have already been discredited by Thos, so any further comments are irrelevant.), I will attempt to come to the company's defense, hopefully without offending anybody much. As far as I am able to determine, the company is unique in the industry. The founder firmly believed in the power of average people to succeed if they were determined to do so. Hence, the lack of a focus on such things as grades or titles. If you really want to succeed in the company, you can. Nobody will stop you. Compensation is, necessarily, 100% commission... If you want to earn more, produce more. Apparently, some people on this site have tried the opportunity, and failed. Is this the fault of the company, or are you just a failure? Responsibility for one's own success or failure is a wonderful part of working for oneself. You have the right to fail. You also have the right to succeed. If you only wish to be average, or earn a supplemental income, by all means, go ahead. Nobody will stop you from only earning $200/month, but it should be understood that nobody will stop you from doing things right and earning $200,000/month either. If you complain about not getting wealthy immediately, with a minimum of work, and subsequently decide to quit, congratulations! You're a loser, and you never even tried! While Primerica doesn't actually tell you how to build a business, it does require that the independent contractors build it within the bounds of the law. Some people do not like the mantra of recruiting to be successful, myself among them. Yes, the company will constantly tell its people to recruit, but I don't think that that should be the goal. As it isn't a requirement, only a recommendation of how one MIGHT become successful, I have decided to build my business using a different system. I believe that by learning everything myself before recruiting and teaching others is the smartest thing to do, so I have done so. I also believe that recruiting a bunch of slacking whiners is bad for the business (case in point: anybody writing to this site complaining), so I intend to try to recruit only those that I feel have guts, as it were. This is not to say that I discriminate, far from it; any race, creed, gender, religion, nationality, et cetera, is welcome. Those that ask for us to train someone with our own referrals must not know much about multi-level marketing. This is the way we expand. I will exhaustively train a recruit, both with product knowledge and field experience. If they don't have referrals coming in, obviously their training is a lower priority than training someone that can expand my business... I am still willing to train them with my own referrals, and give them some to get them started, but I hope you understand that this is not the smartest way to build a business. A word about the products, before I stop wasting time: You forget, Primerica (formerly A.L. Williams) INVENTED Term life insurance. All the other insurance companies out there were very angry about this, because suddenly their clients were starting to realize that Cash Value is very bad for the average consumer. In response to Primerica, other companies started offering Term insurance, generally to convert it later to Cash Value. Many such policies are Annual Renewable Term, which are much more expensive over the lifetime. Primerica's rates are very competetive, and even if they weren't, why would you want a term policy through a company that hates the concept in the first place, and only created it in response to a very real threat? SMART loans are the best consolidation loans available on the market today, and even a minimal amount of research will show you that. The secret? Simple interest, equity builder, and a Personal Financial Analyst to help answer questions. Another point: no other financial planning firm even addresses the debt issue. If you go anywhere else and say "I have debt, but I want to save money for retirement," you'll be laughed at. CFPs only want to talk to rich people. Mutual Funds: We offer funds from 11 different companies, leaders in the industry. A share funds tend to outperform index funds, and no-load funds are a joke. If you feel comfortable sending your hard-earned savings to total strangers, spending more time with your fund research than with your family, thinking you can time the market and switch funds at just the right moment, and not receiving any advice whatsoever, go ahead. If you aren't willing to pay a fee for professional services, let me ask you this: do you diagnose and treat your own medical problems, or represent yourself in court? Incidentally, no mutual funds are ever FDIC insured. Ever. It doesn't take a BBA in Economics (which, by the way, I have) to know this. If, for some odd reason, a representative fails to state this, such information is contained in a fund's prospectus. My time is more valuable than this. See you from the top!

James... you don't have to thank me for reading your rebuttal, it was pure brilliance. Here's my two cents worth (pretty much the same as yours). It is perfectly reasonable to expect that you will have an honest indication of how much, or how little you could make at a job, even if the job is a commissioned position. I think you would be hard pressed to find a reputable employer that would refuse to show you what his average earners and top earners bring home, or any other such reasonable requests aimed at giving you an idea of your income potential. If you get a job in any kind of service establishment, you will know your wage before you start, which makes the propriety of asking your employer about their income a moot point, because it's unnecessary. If you are accepted for a professional type position, compensation negotiation is a standard part of the process, again negating the cause for any questions. If you are being "recruited" for a job via a pitch involving huge income potential, you are fully within your rights as a potential employee to request information verifying such assertions. If your interviewer decides to show you the door when you request such information, then you are better off without that "opportunity." The only reason to hide or deny such information is because the six-figure-rhetoric doesn't match the 1040. If you were to ask a first-day Primerica agent-in-training what he thought he was going to make over the next year, I bet you his figure would be a far cry from the actual average of about $700 (for the entire year). With such a huge discrepancy between anticipated and actual earnings, your company should be required by law to disclose income information to every recruit as a standard part of the intake procedure. It has been asserted in a previous rebuttal by a Primerica supporter tht people should gather their own information and make an informed decision. If this is how you feel, why do you want to deny that recruits have a right to the satistical information about agents in a particular office? I may not have the truth, you may not have a truth, but the truth exists in the records, and potential employees should be given access to them.

Circular Reasoning is the game of the day for Primerica. As part of Citigroup, they are the gangrene that must be amputated to save any good parts that are left. As Kim pointed out, selling someone a get-out-of-debt loan, then mailing them a Citibank Credit Card application is very unethical, as giving an AA graduate alcohol would be. If you are going to present issues or defend them and expect to be respected as a professional - PROOFREAD! I am sick of reading crap that any person with self-respect would have noticed on a once-over. Let me reiterate from my earlier post - typos sneak in on everyone; using "to" instead of "too" and "of" instead of "off" is inexcusible. You can buy a desk set of reference thesaurus and dictionary for about six bucks - I recommend you skip the next trip to Greaseburger World, if necessary. Ultimately, you undermine your own case, and sound completely ignorant as well. "Flames" to or about others accomplish nothing except to piss people off. If you want to present an argument, do so rationally and you may have a chance, otherwise you waste your own and others' time. Isn't that one of Primerica's goals anyway - "to give you more free time"? In my own interview process here in Flagstaff, I asked what the pay structure was. After some hedging, I was told "no base salary, everything is dependent on your recruiting". I asked if I was selling and the answer was "no, I'm recruiting you to be a manger of the people who do sell, and you may have to help them sometimes." Who are they? "[You] and I will recruit them." Manage an untrained sales force that hasn't been hired? Oh, yes, pick me...(sarcasm) I graduated from NAU with a BSBA in CIS, and I plan to work in an MIS (tech management) capacity. I have a temporary job at the Center for Data Insight until the end of summer when the current batch of client contracts expire, which was why I agreed to talk when I got the "management recruiting" phone call. Specific to Walter's comments, I have a few: It is not unreasonable to ask what the interviewer earns, especially if they are interviewing you for a junior position doing the same thing. They are of course NOT required to say what they personally earn, but they should say what the rate FOR THAT POSITION in the company is, and be prepared to say how it compares to the industry average for the same position. If nothing else, they should say the base rate, and then highlight the "total compenstation" just as every HR department in the world does. If they can't tell you at least this much, something fishy (at least) is going on. I do give credit to my contact for being square with me on the salary issue, for the record. As for being "kicked out" for asking about YOUR possible pay by reference to the interviewer's - BULL; and if they do, then the company is either unethical or the person is too easily offended to foster a good working relationship anyway. As far as "trying it on an interview" I have, and even Primerica didn't "laugh or kick me out." Raytheon, Honeywell, Intel, and Micron all treated it as a totally reasonable question, and discussed the pay structure of the position I was interviewing for in detail, with the universal disclaimer of "no guarantees, but you could...(be promoted, get a bonus, transfer, etc depending on the company)" "The turnover rate is high in our company..." Can a get a "Hell, yeah, it is" from the crowd? Do the math, for crying out loud, it's OVER 100%! Since 1999, total employees of Primerica has DECREASED to 100,000, after more than that were "brought on board", leaving an attrition rate (quitters divided by hires, FYI) of 149%. Don't insult people by saying "you sound smart" if you aren't sincere, it's rude. "Work their own business" is also bull; if you are employed by someone, it's NOT "your" business. Welcome to capitalism, folks - and that holds true for the real estate and personal agencies as well. As far as "For all any of us know, this can be some people from competitive companies making these comments" is concerned - name your three largest competitors, either nationally or in your region, or if it's truly "your" business, your top two LOCAL competitors. I've got dinner for my co-workers riding on a bet you can't provide that information. Oh, yeah if I did work for [a competitor], why wouldn't I have significant data and proof of my own to establish a case? Well, I don't, because I'm a recent college graduate who doesn't want anyone else to risk the investment on themselves in the form of education or a current job standing on something as nebulous and risky as Primerica. Finally, as Walter says, "Stand up on your own 2 feet & make decisions with all the facts." No kidding? THAT'S WHY WE TAKE THE TIME TO POST ON THIS SITE - don't you get it? The WHOLE POINT of the entire ripoffreport.com website is for people to get "all the facts," including rebuttals from companies, which in some (other) cases have been misunderstood or misrepresented. So for your role as a defender of the legitimacy of Primerica, you haven't been successful. After all, if it was "your" company, couldn't you call it whatever you wanted, like "Walter's Financial Consulting, affiliated with Citigroup"? That would take away the influence of any bad association in people's minds with Primerica. Oh, wait, my bad... But I do encourage people to "Stand up on your own 2 feet & make decisions with all the facts." As opposed to someone else's feet? Standing down? Or making decisions with some facts and some lies? Really, give people some credit - you can blow sunshine all day, but ultimately they have to bypass their own BS filter to accept the Primerica line. In fact, after all of this nonsense, I think I'm going to start using the phrase, "That's SO Primerica" for ideas that are either fundamentally flawed or that make no sense. Let's see how fast it catches on with society, shall we? OK, it'll probably just be mine, but I'm OK with that. Thanks for taking the time to read my post -

Dear Kim & Hammer X (X-Men, X-Box, Arm & Hammer, MC Hammer) Whatever your name is: I am glad this is my second & FINAL response to any remarks made about Primerica. I know you will respond & make your comments, and other people will as well, etc. etc. Primerica is not a perfect company. I have asked before, What company or opportunity is better & why? I have worked for corportate America for a number of years. I know people in bigger companies than I have worked in & smaller. The # of people who make $100,000 or over no where comes near, hear me out NEAR what people in Primerica make. Primerica is a business opportunity. We sell good products & educate people. No one has to brainwash me or train me to say that. You will always find a product out there somewhere that's better than what we offer. However, most companies don't even come close when you do the complete package. I know you will argue this, and you will fight me no matter what I say or even give examples. Many of us know to open a traditional business costs a lot more $ than what Primerica asks for, doesn't it? There are some fees involved with our company, so what! If you don't like it, go cry somewhere else. You obviously have a bad taste in your mouth about our company. The turnover rate is high in our company because people are accustomed to work a job rather than work their own business. You sound like a smart person Kim, You should understand that. People who have pride & care about their company will stick up for it. People who don't usually are just there for a paycheck & would jump to another company in a hearbeat if more $,etc were involved. The commitment level is low, wouldn't you agree? The person Thaos made some good comments. If you asked a person you were interviewing for how much $ they made, etc. they would probably laugh at you or kick you out of their office. Anyone who disputes this, go on an interview & try it. Good luck if it works. All this trash talking about our company is nonsense. We have enough professional industries, etc. giving us high marks. Yeah, we are paying them all of right?? When people see our company & learn more about us, they learn stuff they have never learned before. It seems weird & they feel uncomfortable about it. I was there. People don't like talking to friends & family about business because they are afraid it might be bad or it wouldn't work. That is normal. However, many times when companies give you leads (even qualified leads), they turn out sour too. I don't need Primerica to tell me this, I have done it before. To the people who are skeptical, etc. who listen to the critics here, Stand up on your own 2 feet & make decisions with all the facts. For all any of us know, this can be some people from competitive companies making these comments. Regards.

Such a shame you wasted so much time on that rebuttal. You gave totally false responses on many of the questions. I guess we are not surprised actually, tyical PFS response. 3) What percentage of your company's total sales force earn the "six-figure incomes" that you say are possible in the business? Thos's response-ASk that of any other company and they will show you the door. Primercia Shows it as a courtesy. I guess you missed that point. ***actually primerica tells every single person they can make 100k/a year when in actuality, probably less than 5% do so. If this is a sales tool you use to recruit people, back it up. Everybody that is contacted by PFS hears the same garbage. 4) What percentage of your total reported sales force earns over $50,000 per year, net of chargebacks? Thos's response-Let us see. This is the same type of question. Ask any time in z regular interview and it will be ended. You will not get a call back. With Primerica, you will still get the offer to join. Why because they let the process weed out those that do not want to work. ***this is a legitimate question. Who wants to work for a company, and sell a crappy, non-competitive product, then have half of their sales cancel because the customer knows they got screwed. 5) If I'm interested in becoming a financial planning professional, and I wanted to take courses to become an accredited financial planner (CFP, PFP) with a professional designation, would Primerica pay for these courses? Thos's respinse- Why should they? Does anyone else pays for your college? How about any of your required schooling? How about your drivers license, too? Why should a company have to pay for your licenses, that is something you shoudl get on your own. Um hello. Get a clue. Most large companies offer some type of tuition reimbursement. My company pays 100% for A's, 90% for B's, etc.. Also most companies will pay for a required class, required for a job. My sister has all of her series licenses because she does mortgages, investments, everything and her comany paid for EVERYTHING. Her fiancee works for Charles Schwab and they paid for everything. If I decide to join, will you train me by bringing me on your own personally-generated appointments, so that I can use my "warm market list" for myself when I am licensed? Thos's response-Let us see, you want me to give up my time and talent, to train you. ANd you give nothing to me. Do you think that happens in the real world? OR do you want it to be special. ANd Since every referel that we get is yours, and we average 5 to 10 a sit down, you giving me 10 names and numbers means you get 50 to 100 new ones. Woudl anyone change 10 leads for 50 to 100 leads ***so let's get this straight, you want to recruit people but not take the time to train them? How else do people learn? Could that be why most PFS reps quit early on, because they do not get any support or training? Why are you a recruiter then? Why do you even care if somebody goes to work for PFS? 8) How many Primerica agents quit each year, and how is this expressed as a percentage of the sales force? Thos's response-How many people are layed off or forced to resigned, in other companies? How many people are looking for meaningful work, but can't find it. **you didn't even answer the question. Typical. How about answering the question, instead of asking another question? In other words, please explain the truth-PFS has a 90% turnover rate. FAR greater than most companies. 10) Why should I show up to the same Amway-style "opportunity meeting" week after week? Thos's response-Why should you show up to work every day? Why should you keep practising, and learning more things? Why should you go to Tom Hopkins and Brian Tracy and others forums for more knowledge? Could it be that you need more training? We show up to work everyday because we are guaranteed a paycheck. These meetings do not guarantee anything but a waste of someone's time. It's very expensive brainwashing. They repeat the same things over and over, its very rehearsed, very little if gained from these meetings. 11) Is this Multi-Level Marketing? Thos's response-Yes, and it is also a selling force. You make money on selling, not recruiting people. So where do you make the money? ****if it is MLM, then why don't you tell all the job seekers you guys hound off of websites this when you call them? I do not ever remember the rcruiter telling me it was MLM. According to Monster.com, you guys are in violation of the user agreement for failure to disclose its an MLM and that an up front investent is required for employment. So why are the job sites trying to ban PFS recruiters? 1) Why does Citibank offer VISA cards to customers who just consolidated their debt through Primerica with a $MART LOAN? Thos's response-They do, they have never done that to my Clients. But they do get all these calls and junk letters concerning Credit Cards. May be your information is tainted. Doesn't this seem hypocritical to you? NOt really, Since CitiBank is in business to make money. It is a Sister Company, but not controled by Primerica, What do I say to my clients when they get one, thorw it away, you do not need it do you? ***that seems very hypocritical, to get somebody out of debt and to tempt them with more. That is like you going through an AA program, and they send you a 6 pack of beer to congratulate you. Citigroup and PFS is in the market to make money, that does not make it right or ethical.

The Problem with Pessimists are they are right some of the time and only want you to remember those times. HEre are these questions answered with the light of the real world. ONe Question, In an INterview for any company, If you asked any of these questions to your interviewer, what would happen? MOST OF ALL - USE COMMON SENSE - IF IT SOUNDS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE, IT USUALLY IS! "OPPORTUNITY" RELATED QUESTIONS: 1) Please show me your tax returns for each and every year you have been in PFS. If the tax returns look impressive - ask the following: Would Anyone do this for a comapany that they are going to be working for? What woudl the recruiter tell you? Why Should Primerica be any different from any other position, that is 100% Commission. I Guess You think because it is a MLM, that means you can attack it. 2) How many people do you over-ride (through all generations), and what is their individual average annual income from earned commissions, net of chargebacks? (Demand a real average - not an "on track" number). Would you be able to do this with your trainer at any other company? There is really no difference between Primerica and any other company. If you are selling cars, you are required to get a license that is not paid for by the company. And then you are on commission. The Problem is that since you can make money off people, PFSWATCH believes it can control the Interveiw. 3) What percentage of your company's total sales force earn the "six-figure incomes" that you say are possible in the business? ASk that of any other company and they will show you the door. Primercia Shows it as a courtesy. I guess you missed that point. How long does it take the average person to earn a six-figure income in this business, or is it true, as presented in the opportunity meeting disclaimers, that "only the super-achievers" can earn this kind of money? Why should you care what average people do? What about the average person at your job, can you find out how much they make with out getting fired? 4) What percentage of your total reported sales force earns over $50,000 per year, net of chargebacks? Let us see. This is the same type of question. Ask any time in z regular interview and it will be ended. You will not get a call back. With Primerica, you will still get the offer to join. Why because they let the process weed out those that do not want to work. Is this calculated on a calendar-year basis or on a rolling 12-month basis? 5) If I'm interested in becoming a financial planning professional, and I wanted to take courses to become an accredited financial planner (CFP, PFP) with a professional designation, would Primerica pay for these courses? Why should they? Does anyone else pays for your college? How about any of your required schooling? How about your drivers license, too? Why should a company have to pay for your licenses, that is something you shoudl get on your own. 6) If I told you today that I was interested and wanted to learn more about the business, would you take me on 10 of your own personally-booked appointments (booked with contacts that you have personally generated, without my assistance) to see if I like the business? Yes, we woudl, If you followed the rules of an observer. An Obserever looks but not talks, does not interupt, and does not interject during any part of the presentation. Would you do this without me paying $199 for an IBA, and without me providing you a list of my friends and relatives, also known as a "warm-market list"? Yes, we would. If I decide to join, will you train me by bringing me on your own personally-generated appointments, so that I can use my "warm market list" for myself when I am licensed? Let us see, you want me to give up my time and talent, to train you. ANd you give nothing to me. Do you think that happens in the real world? OR do you want it to be special. ANd Since every referel that we get is yours, and we average 5 to 10 a sit down, you giving me 10 names and numbers means you get 50 to 100 new ones. Woudl anyone change 10 leads for 50 to 100 leads? 7) Please show me your day-planner for the past 6 months and please show me your gross sales figures for the same period, including chargebacks. Would you ask that of a recruiter or a manager of a job you are applying for? Would you be able to do that at the car lot? I do not think so, but you expect them to do it, NICE. Please show me your business-related expenses over the same period (ie: car, gas, food, etc), so that I can have a reasonable idea of what I can expect to spend to generate income. And you are going to work the same degree of hardness and same level? I do not think so, but then again most people that join think that it is a get rich quick scheme. That is not so. 8) How many Primerica agents quit each year, and how is this expressed as a percentage of the sales force? How many people are layed off or forced to resigned, in other companies? How many people are looking for meaningful work, but can't find it. How does this compare to the industry at large? It is equal to the industry at large, and if you compare statistics, we are lower than most jobs out there for turn over, but then that woudl throw your ideas out the window. Can you provide third-party evidence to support your claims? Yes we can, to bad the party that posted this, uses third rate sources to back their evidence 9) How can I become a Regional Vice-President without recruiting people to go and recruit more people? You can't, but then again you can still make money selling products. IF that is what you want, we let you. But if you want to have the freedom like a RVP then you need to recruit. 10) Why should I show up to the same Amway-style "opportunity meeting" week after week? Why should you show up to work every day? Why should you keep practising, and learning more things? Why should you go to Tom Hopkins and Brian Tracy and others forums for more knowledge? Could it be that you need more training? Ans what if someone on the team needs your help, would you want them to owe you, so they will feel obligated to help you in your time of need? 11) Is this Multi-Level Marketing? Yes, and it is also a selling force. You make money on selling, not recruiting people. So where do you make the money? (If they say it is NOT multi-level marketing, or use the famous "Do you like Multi-Level Marketing" script, they may be breaking Federal/State/and Provincial laws). Asking a question is not against any laws, So you are wrong here? It is called a porquepine. It is a way to get at the root of the question. But then if you knew anything you are posting here, you woudl know that it is not against the law. "Network Marketing" is just another way of saying "Multi-Level Marketing". 12) One of your leaders has been quoted as saying that "The Secret of PFS is to keep 'em coming and going.". Is it true that this business is often described by your leaders as "a numbers game" and that "...if you throw enough SH** against the wall, some of it will stick"? Sales is a number games. Go ask any Car LOT, or any other sales force. you will average 8 people 5 will stick around to hear what you ahve to say, 3 will buy, and 1 one will become a recruit or an advocate. That is the numbers in any sales book. Am I one of these numbers? Yes you are, but you can one of thiose that join, or ones that does not, but that is up to you. I woudl not let a group of people who are bent on trying to destroy the company that made them lose millions of dollars in premiums and payments make the decsision for me. Especially with this obviously tainted questionaire. Would any Recruiter let you ask these questions, at an interview, about their company? Also rmeember we are in the attraction Business, we do not need to beg. The only problem I see is that we charge to little to join. If it was a MILLION dollars, we would have aline out the door to waiting to get in like McDonalds. CONSUMER/PRODUCT RELATED QUESTIONS: 1) Why does Citibank offer VISA cards to customers who just consolidated their debt through Primerica with a $MART LOAN? They do, they have never done that to my Clients. But they do get all these calls and junk letters concerning Credit Cards. May be your information is tainted. Doesn't this seem hypocritical to you? NOt really, Since CitiBank is in business to make money. It is a Sister Company, but not controled by Primerica, What do I say to my clients when they get one, thorw it away, you do not need it do you? 2) If Cash-Surrender/Cash-Value/Whole-Life insurance is as bad as you say it is, why does Primerica make millions of dollars of profit from its sale each year, through their wholly-owned subsidiary, National Benefit Life, as reported in Best's Review? IN buying certina companies, We have to keep certain policies in affect, if the Client wants to. Since we buy into companies, which is a better system that creating our own, we have to stay with in the laws of each state and the federal. To bad, the poster here does not have to follow any rules and regulations, because they are supposed to be outsiders looking in, but in my opinion they are employees of certain companies that would love to see Primerica fall, so they can go back to the old days. This is where Cash Value was king and Term was sold but you got harrassed into converting it. (PFS agents in New York state are licensed through National Benefit Life.) 3) What percentage of your sales force are professional financial planners, ie: CFPs? I am curious, SInce most people are Part-time people, Why is this important? Does a professional stauts mean you have more ethical standards? Does it mean you make less mistakes? Does it make you perfect? All it means you took a class or have ahd a license long enough and paid a fee. This is foolish, but then some of these questions are truely foolish. Why are there so few? Is there no value in becoming a certified professional? Since Certification is only matters in areas where it is regulated. You can be certified in Securities by the Federal Government, Certified to sell Life, ehalth, disability, long term care insurances. Personally I have talk to alot of those people who have those CERTIFICATION. They know less and only go for high commission products. They may have those little letters behind their names but they are pusching people in the wrong areas. The best example is those on Wall Street getting fined. 4) According to your company web-site, (www.pfsnet.com), hidden under "important disclosures" the FNA is "not a financial plan" and PFS reps are "not financial planners". Do you let prospective customers know that you are not financial planners and that they should seek the advice of a professional planner if they wish to obtain a financial plan? Funny, what they gave me was a plan. Told me how to reach a place. It look liked one. Told me where I was and how to get where I wanted to go. It told me how much I needed to save for college, retirement. the amount and type of life insurance. It even told me how much I need to make up to reach my goals. What type of plan do you want? And how much will it cost you? 5) If "Buy Term and Invest the Difference" makes sense for most people, wouldn't people benefit most by buying the CHEAPEST term available from a top-rated company, and investing the difference? And what is cheaper than them. I did a search when Primerica was here. they were within a couple dollars of that quote. SO why woudl I want to have to call seven peopel to get the same answers I can get with one phone call. My time is valuable. 6) Why would I re-finance my debt with you at a higher interest rate when I could go to an independent mortgage broker and get a lower rate and similar prepayment options? Rate only matters if the loan is the same. If they sold simple interst loans, then I would say go for it. But since they do not, but sell scheduled interest loans it is not the same loan. the difference is with simple interest your interest payments go down with each payment ( It si re-amortised), where the scheduled interest loans are scheduled to be re-amortised every 6 months to a year. 7) Can I purchase no-load mutual funds or index funds from you? Yes, but why would anyone work for free? Do you value my time so little that you woudl not want me to make money? If that is true, then why are you my client? If you want to do that you can go to a discount broker firm and get that, but remember they will not help you with your 401K, or other problems. ANd when you need us to help with other problems, doi you think I am going to drop what I am doing and come running or doing you think I will do it at my leisure. 8) Can you provide me with a written financial plan detailing advanced estate planning and taxation issues? No, but I can introduce you to someone that can. He is a lawyer. 9) Is it true that "Personal Financial Analyst" is just a proprietary term developed by your company, and is not a professional designation? Well, if you want to know no, since I am by definition a person wjho does Financial analysis on my clients. So by definition I am a Personal Financial Analysis. 10) I've heard many of your agents suggest that banks and insurance companies have been ripping off consumers for years. How do you explain the fact that your sister companies include a company that finances consumer debt at interest rates as high as 28.8 per cent (Citifinancial/ex-Associates) , a whole-life/cash value insurance company (Travelers and NBL), and one of the worlds largest banks (Citibank) who make BILLIONS from consumer debt each year? Since they are our SISTER Companies and we can't control them any more we can control CITIGROUP. Why are you asking us this question. Are we in NEw York, no I am in California, and it does not matter what happens in any other part of the company, only how you are treated. Understand? 11) Are you willing to put all of your answers in writing, and subject them to the scrutiny of Federal/State/Provincial regulators? Yes, just like we like to have our competitors put their in writings. To bad they do not want to even let us tape them during confrontations. they get nervous because they are limited in what they can say because if they slip up they will be fined and possibily lose their license For All to UNderstand. Ken Young and PFSWATCH are run by the corporations that Primerica has been attacking for years. Ken Young started out in the Midwest, but now resides in Texas. the reason is that he had to move because of false allegations he placed on his website. Primerica has ask to see many times this lawsuit that he has one against them, but he keeps from producing it. PFSWATCH is funded by agents and companies that Primerica has taken money, by replacing Cash Value ( Better known as Trash value) policies and giving Term policies and helping people save the difference in mutual funds. They are angry and know that if they say some of the thigns they post here, across the kitchen table they woudl lose big money. But since it is a Website, they have a lot more leneincy. So Now you know the source. My SOurce is my experiences before joining Primerica. I had a term Policy from ALlstate. They monthly and sometimes twice a month sent me letters trying to convert it to a Cash Value Policy. I have had older friends get the letter that their policy was going to implode. Which means they are going to llose thier policy since the money in it is gone. They would have to pay huge amounts to keep the coverage inforced. their agents were never found, or said it was thier problem. In recent years, I have been an agent. IN confrontations, I see how cash value agents treat their clients. I ahve seen policies sold as retirement plans, whihc is against the law. I have seen peopel get 5 policies sold to them, and theyn total less than 200,000 dollars, but cost 300 a month. That is 10 times what term cost. and that extra has not made a difference in their savings. I ahve seen people sold Accidental Death and Dismemberment policies but told it was Lfie insurance. These policies are worthless, since they pay so infrequently.

Ken Young may or may not have a good point in his rebuttal - it seems like he was too busy slamming out a "flame" to his own "parroted" website and message board. I personally found this section of the ripoff report via a link on the pfswatch site, if it matters to you, Ken, and your site didn't come up in the first 50 results of a Google search using "Primerica" as the only search term. Out of curiosity, after reading this article, I tried various permutations of "PFS", "Citigroup", "Traveler's", and "Entrepreneur", "Scam", "MLM", "Pyramid", and other terms of that nature. None of the first page of results of ANY of those searches returned your site either. (I do have other things to do, so I wasn't going to spend ALL day checking results for your site) In other words, Ken - it's hard to believe you have the credibility you claim, when you provide no references to back it up. Lastly, I understand that typos tend to sneak their way in when you are typing under emotional strain - whether as a legitimate umbrage at another's "parroting", or not - but your rebuttal is so full of grammatical effluent (look it up) that as Pedram's reply notes, it is hard to follow at best, and still leaves any reader in doubt as to the foundation of your argument.

http://www.100insurers.com/wwwboard/messages/6548.html is a website with a post from the Ken Young guy who did the rebuttal... Play close attention to his English... This person is obviously a moron, he can barely spell and what is even more obvious morons should not to be trusted with other peoples money. Lastly, was it me or did he refute the claim by not answering a single question? What a way to debate. The initiating poster is correct in many if not all fronts and I only wish that I had accessed this site prior to making my "Interview" with a Primerica cultist.

If somebody pulls up your name on an internet search w/ Primerica, a few different websites pull up that you post on. Seems like you have alot of time on your hand too to be cluttering up the net defending your loser company, and all the losers that work for it. I highly recommend you occupy your time doing something else. Have a nice day!

Weren't you someone who at one time was a PFSer "Dork" yourself that was also involved in ripping the public off by orchestrating the standard order of procedure PFS Sales Division's false, misleading and deceptive sales, marketing, recruiting, replacement of existing in-force insurance, Mutual Fund Sales and Mortgage Refinancing loans? I a happy to see that you have elected to seek refevenge and retaliate against the PFS Sales Division for terminating your working agreement with the company by using the same mehtods and techniques of exposing their questionable business practices as I originated to expose them nationally in excess of twenty years ago. QUESTION.... If your working agreement had not been terminated on you by Primerica (fired), would you still be very much involved in bilking the public out of their hard earned money through the PFS Sales Division instead of sponsoring this service? What is sad about the scenario is that you are attepting to build a consultant business out of your efforts for your purpose of gaining financial remuneration while others of us perform in the form of a free public service for consumers. I also notice that each and every time I post a new category announcement to the message board I sponsor and the web-site I own, shortly thereafter you mimic and ape the category I will be introducing. Sorry Bud, but you will always be nothing more than a blurred carbon copy of Ken Young, so lean to live and accept it. Now after you read this message don't forget to jump on your keyboard and send another wave of your fruitless virus filled e-mail messages to me and your hate messages posted to our message board in your attempts to harrass our viewers and posters. Better yet, don't forget to file another complaint to the owner of the domain our message board is on once again threatening to sue him if I keep posting your pseudo posting names when I expose you also on our message board. Maybe once again you can fruitlessly attempt to gain entry to our message board's password as you did once before telling the domain owner that I had died and allegedly you were our message board's co-sponsor with in your intent of getting in to our board and shutting our most informative and number one of message board of its kind on the internet down. Don't you think it is about time you played your own part in paying back the money that your personal consumer clients were bilked out of by your own personal use of the PFS Sales Division's "Dorks" canned sales presentations? Finally, why don't you for once in your life on all of the web-sites and message boards you sponsor stand up like a man and indentify yourself by name? What are you attempting to hide from behind your cloak of darkness? Ken Young