- Report: #2094
Complaint Review: MetroTech Aviation Career Center - Oklahoma City Oklahoma
-
Author Not Confirmed
Why?
MetroTech Aviation Career Center
5600 S. MacArthur Blvd. Oklahoma City, 73179 Oklahoma, U.S.A.
Phone:
(405) 685-0008
Web:
N/A
Categories:
Business Rating:
(0)
Tell us has your experience with this business or person been good?
MetroTech Aviation Career Center Oklahoma City Rip-off Ripping off Oklahomans Since 1988 ..METRO TECH REBUTTAL ..VICTIM RESPONDS BACK
I enrolled at MTACC in August of 1996 with the hope of bettering myself and my life.
At my enrollment interview with the school's dean, Dr. David Neal, I was told that careers in aviation were high paying and always in demand.
My first instructor was Mr. Mike Moreland. Mr. Moreland had been with MTACC since the program had opened back in 1988. He was a former instructor at Tulsa Technology Center but he had never worked in the aviation field.
Mr. Moreland knows the material in a most comprehensive and detailed manner. I have no doubts he could teach the material if he wanted to. There is the point.
Mr. Moreland is a giant among his students and peers only because he cuts them off at the knees to make himself look larger. The failure rate of his classes are 70% or higher and he seems to become angry if more pass his tests than he wants. None of his tests were easy even if the topic was elementary.
If the test could not be made hard alone by the subject material he would enter extra material not covered in either the books or the lectures. If the material is hard and the time given to the subject to long in his opinion classroom time will consist mostly of pushing around airplanes on the tarmac out back or he will conveniently take a few days off; leaving his class with
a hopless unprepared instructor.
He does not like questions. In the labs he is almost nonexistent but the tasks given are fairly easy. Mr. Moreland has an ego as large as Texas, is as abrasive as they come, and if challenged in anyway will find time for extra curricular revenge. He is a petty man that has found the job that strokes his ego.
Mr. Crawford, the evening instructor in training. A nice gentleman that was clueless in all respects. The night classes received little or no instruction while he was in training to become an instructor. Mr. Crawford was an engineer by trade, had worked in the field, and had a A+P certification. Mr. Crawford was ritually humiliated by Mr. Moreland while he was learning from him to teach the course materials. He was as angry with
Mr. Moreland's personality as the students. He filled in the day classes when Mr. Moreland decided to take a few days off. I think he had his heart in it but had chosen the wrong place to begin a career as a A+P instructor.
There was another old man that filled in for Herr Dr. Moreland. He was an old helicopter mechanic. He had the mental capacity of Ronald Reagan today. He spent his time breaking things and not doing a thing Moreland told him to. I don't know if this was senility or his way of dealing with Moreland, I mean, Herr Dr.
Mr. Clay Pate the second block instructor; Airframe. Very knowledgeable although he could easily be side tracked in class with stories of the "Vietnam War" or "Eastern Airlines". He was aware of Moreland's flaws and tried to remedy them by covering the material by the book. His classes would test by using the questions that would be asked on the actual A+P exam instead of a handmade monstrosity. Herr Dr., always trying to cause
trouble, would complain to Dr. Neal endlessly about his doing so. Moreland would volunteer Mr. Pate's class to push around airplanes on the tarmac diverting valuable classroom time away from the students.
I had only one problem with Mr Pate's teaching method; don't get me wrong, I thought he was a nice guy and knew his stuff. Failure rates went down considerably in his class. Mr. Pate had a motto, "Perfect makes perfect."
He would assign projects and walk the halls. You would try and ask he a question on how best to do the project assigned and he would shrug his shoulders and walk off. These projects were difficult, some instruction was needed. This angered me to no end. I don't now what his problem was. He would talk of "integrity"; I wish he had a little more of it when it came to the hands on aspect of instructing the course.
I quite after the second block. I was totally fed up, had failed over half of the classes, the next instructor had a reputation worse than Moreland's, and if I had went on I would have had to retake the failed courses with the same rotten instructors. I was not alone; three-fourths of the class I was
in was in the same boat. I do not see how the school graduates even 10% of those than enroll. To make up the time and classes I would have more than doubled my time there.
More than half of the time at MTACC is wasted pushing around airplanes, preparing for the air show they sponsor "Air America" (extra credit is given if you help them run the concession stands), or listening to lectures not related to the classroom material.
This was not the straw that broke the camel's back though.
Toward the middle of the second block employers were brought in to the school by Dr. Neal to talk to students about future employment (if they ever passed, sic!). Dr. Neal was about ready to quit after going though a messy divorce and sat in his office all day drinking "Beefeater" gin. Warning, he is now
dean of a small community college in southern California.
The average package offered to the student was at $6 to $10 and usually involved a move across the country. One student that had just graduated moved to Wichita, KS to work for Cessna. A week and a half later he was laid off with the rest of the plant. I would always ask these employers if they included a refrigerator box to live in after hearing about the low wages and intermittent employment.
I left in the evening to avoid a confrontation. I was extremely angry at having wasted a year on an effort of futility. They would not have liked my explanations for leaving and only wanted to keep me around to suck more money out of me.
I wrote a letter of complaint to the top director of MetroTech School's, Dr Kara G. Wilson. In the letter I explained why I left and the current state of the school in my opinion. I received her reply on school letterhead, handwritten, all in capital letters, "GET A LIFE!". I hoped it had occurred
to her that I had been trying to get a life by enrolling in her school and putting up with her insufferable instructors for a year.
Total wasted expenditure about TEN GRAND and a year of my life.
I wrote letters to my State Representative, the Governor, The Oklahoma Board of Public Vocational Schools. I included copies of both my letter and her's.
They all shrugged their shoulders collectively. If OBPVS had done an investigation they would have surely found enough evidence to pull their accreditation on finding the low amount of students graduating from the program. I suspect payola is involved as a few minor administrators have had their personal aircraft repaired at the school by the instructors.
Oklahoma's tax dollars at work!
I wrote the Federal Aviation Administration to find out those exact numbers but met a bureaucratic wall. No one seemed to know what kind of statistics I wanted from them.
Shortly after starting my own personal investigation into the way MetroTech does business, asking a lot of biting questions, I received a call from the Oklahoma City Police Department asking me to stop "harassing" Dr. Wilson.
MetroTech employs a good number of OKCPD as security on all of their campuses. I can well imagine one of them being asked to intimidate me into silence. I must be nice to have your own "Goon Squad" on the payroll.
MetroTech Aviation Career Center continues on their merry way. I have a lifetime ban from the school for asking questions they didn't like and for complaining about the way they treat their clients.
Before you enroll at MetroTech or consider a career in aviation consider what I have said a warning!
[email protected]
..........................................
METRO TECH REBUTTAL - ..then, VICTIM RESPONDS BACK
Subj: Rebuttal to Report Metro Tech's Aviation Career Center
Date: 6/2/00 9:16:43 AM US Mountain Standard Time
From: [email protected] (Pete Lee)
To: [email protected]
The individual that expressed their displeasure with Metro Tech's Aviation Career Center has been at odds with Metro Tech for more than three years.
The source of discontent is that the individual had a personality conflict with two of the instructors that were and are on staff currently. According to memos and letters written to the site director at the time the only acceptable recourse was to fire the two instructors involved. When the Site Director would not accommodate the person stating the complaint, the Site
Director was then included in list of individuals that should be fired. This was further expanded to include all instructors on staff including those who had no contact with the individual.
The two instructors cited by the complainant have repeatedly been
complimented by their students for devotion to the profession and a genuine interest in the individual students. One of the instructors routinely has a class meet at his house during the weekend for cook outs and just "hanging out". The other instructor would remain three or four hours after class to
assist students in completing work projects or to provide individualized instruction.
The individual did take 30 classes of the Aviation Maintenance Technician program. The individual was absent for approximately 50 hours of instruction and must retake four courses. Fourteen other classes are incomplete for either missed time or incomplete work. It is probable that the inability to complete the required course work is what prompted the initial and
continuing displeasure by this person.
On several occasions the person lodging the complaint was offered an opportunity to express concerns and disagreements. At each juncture what was requested from the complainant was ever increasing and unacceptable demands.
Complaints were registered with the State Department of Vo Tech and it was inferred by the individual that legislative representatives were contacted.
The written communication from the individual was increasingly erratic and appeared to be disjointed. Review by District representatives and local law enforcement personnel determined that this individual was a jeopardy to public safety. For that reason the individual is not permitted on Metro Tech campuses. Arrangements were made with another training institution for the
individual to complete their training. As far as can be determined the individual has not availed themselves of the opportunity to complete the training.
Furthering this individual's aggravation was the unsubstantiated claim that the Aviation Industry was paying starting wages at the minimum wage level.
Four years ago when the purported layoff incident occurred, the Aerospace Industry was emerging from a significantly depressed market. Since that time demand for trained aircraft workers has increased and starting salaries are in the range of $10.00 to $12.00 per hour. Recruiters from across the nation are seeking licensed aircraft mechanics. Signing bonuses and moving expenses
are being offered to successful candidates.
Since the individual left the program in August 1997, 69 individuals have completed the AMT program and a majority of them are actively employed in the industry.
The Director and staff of Metro Tech's Aviation Career Center would invite anyone who has an interest in training to be an Aviation Maintenance Technician to visit in person the Aviation Career Center located at Will Rogers World Airport and meet with the staff. Arrangements could be made so a prospective student could ask current and former students about their opinion of the program.
VICTIM RESPONDS BACK TO REBUTTAL
.........................................
Subj: Consumer's Rebuttal to Metro Tech's
Aviation Career Center Rebuttal
Date: 6/2/00 1:37:59 PM US Mountain Standard Time
From: ExExpat93
To: [email protected]
I believe I covered all points in my first complaint and I did contact my state Representative, state Senator, the Governors Office, Oklahoma Department of Vocational Schools, and a public television program where citizens of this state are allowed to place questions to local government officials.
I work full-time unlike many students. I have to support myself and a family. The school is 5 days a week. Yes, I did miss a number of days while attending the school and had the opportunity to make up those days at the end of the course; in fact I could have made up those days while retaking the courses I had failed. I did as well as those that did not have full-time jobs so a good number of my fellow students could have retaken the subjects with me. I could get permission from some of the students to list their names to corroborate my account but at this time it is rather pointless. They list people who are working in the aviation field as those who enlist in the military after they leave the school. Ask them about those that enter the private sector and the number goes down considerably.
Glad to see they included their close relationship with law enforcement which they hire on their campuses. Everything would have been peachy if I hadn't stopped attending the school and complained about the school. They are only interested in the money.
I complained about the school because my complaints are justified. Yes, I did call for the dismal of some of the instructors to improve the course. I would have been satisfied if they had been given reprimands or notices to improve but I would not take another class with them as they would have been as highly displeased with me as I was with them. They have made no remedies to the situation and see no problem with the large numbers of students failing the amount of courses.
So, three years have passed. They are still wrong. I have a ban from the school. It is kind of hard to retake the courses if you are banned from the school and too much time has passed to pick up where I left off even if they made amends by reforming their course. I am still out time and effort by attending this shoddy excuse for a school.
Ask many students that have attended MetroTech Aviation Career Center; many are working in this community not in the aviation field. The wages in the aviation field are dismal even if you somehow complete this school.
Yes, Mr. Moreland does offer a pizza party when he gets student evaluations on his personal performance in class. Most of the after school time referred to graciously donated to students is usually in meetings with the director. I had no beef with Mr. Pate outside of his not instructing during the hands on aspect of the course.
If I was a great risk to "public safety" would I be using this form and appeals to my representatives in government to address my grievances about this school?
I join MetroTech in an invitation to attend the school if you are up for a very expensive lesson. I will leave that up to you decide if I am correct in my condemnation of this school.
At my enrollment interview with the school's dean, Dr. David Neal, I was told that careers in aviation were high paying and always in demand.
My first instructor was Mr. Mike Moreland. Mr. Moreland had been with MTACC since the program had opened back in 1988. He was a former instructor at Tulsa Technology Center but he had never worked in the aviation field.
Mr. Moreland knows the material in a most comprehensive and detailed manner. I have no doubts he could teach the material if he wanted to. There is the point.
Mr. Moreland is a giant among his students and peers only because he cuts them off at the knees to make himself look larger. The failure rate of his classes are 70% or higher and he seems to become angry if more pass his tests than he wants. None of his tests were easy even if the topic was elementary.
If the test could not be made hard alone by the subject material he would enter extra material not covered in either the books or the lectures. If the material is hard and the time given to the subject to long in his opinion classroom time will consist mostly of pushing around airplanes on the tarmac out back or he will conveniently take a few days off; leaving his class with
a hopless unprepared instructor.
He does not like questions. In the labs he is almost nonexistent but the tasks given are fairly easy. Mr. Moreland has an ego as large as Texas, is as abrasive as they come, and if challenged in anyway will find time for extra curricular revenge. He is a petty man that has found the job that strokes his ego.
Mr. Crawford, the evening instructor in training. A nice gentleman that was clueless in all respects. The night classes received little or no instruction while he was in training to become an instructor. Mr. Crawford was an engineer by trade, had worked in the field, and had a A+P certification. Mr. Crawford was ritually humiliated by Mr. Moreland while he was learning from him to teach the course materials. He was as angry with
Mr. Moreland's personality as the students. He filled in the day classes when Mr. Moreland decided to take a few days off. I think he had his heart in it but had chosen the wrong place to begin a career as a A+P instructor.
There was another old man that filled in for Herr Dr. Moreland. He was an old helicopter mechanic. He had the mental capacity of Ronald Reagan today. He spent his time breaking things and not doing a thing Moreland told him to. I don't know if this was senility or his way of dealing with Moreland, I mean, Herr Dr.
Mr. Clay Pate the second block instructor; Airframe. Very knowledgeable although he could easily be side tracked in class with stories of the "Vietnam War" or "Eastern Airlines". He was aware of Moreland's flaws and tried to remedy them by covering the material by the book. His classes would test by using the questions that would be asked on the actual A+P exam instead of a handmade monstrosity. Herr Dr., always trying to cause
trouble, would complain to Dr. Neal endlessly about his doing so. Moreland would volunteer Mr. Pate's class to push around airplanes on the tarmac diverting valuable classroom time away from the students.
I had only one problem with Mr Pate's teaching method; don't get me wrong, I thought he was a nice guy and knew his stuff. Failure rates went down considerably in his class. Mr. Pate had a motto, "Perfect makes perfect."
He would assign projects and walk the halls. You would try and ask he a question on how best to do the project assigned and he would shrug his shoulders and walk off. These projects were difficult, some instruction was needed. This angered me to no end. I don't now what his problem was. He would talk of "integrity"; I wish he had a little more of it when it came to the hands on aspect of instructing the course.
I quite after the second block. I was totally fed up, had failed over half of the classes, the next instructor had a reputation worse than Moreland's, and if I had went on I would have had to retake the failed courses with the same rotten instructors. I was not alone; three-fourths of the class I was
in was in the same boat. I do not see how the school graduates even 10% of those than enroll. To make up the time and classes I would have more than doubled my time there.
More than half of the time at MTACC is wasted pushing around airplanes, preparing for the air show they sponsor "Air America" (extra credit is given if you help them run the concession stands), or listening to lectures not related to the classroom material.
This was not the straw that broke the camel's back though.
Toward the middle of the second block employers were brought in to the school by Dr. Neal to talk to students about future employment (if they ever passed, sic!). Dr. Neal was about ready to quit after going though a messy divorce and sat in his office all day drinking "Beefeater" gin. Warning, he is now
dean of a small community college in southern California.
The average package offered to the student was at $6 to $10 and usually involved a move across the country. One student that had just graduated moved to Wichita, KS to work for Cessna. A week and a half later he was laid off with the rest of the plant. I would always ask these employers if they included a refrigerator box to live in after hearing about the low wages and intermittent employment.
I left in the evening to avoid a confrontation. I was extremely angry at having wasted a year on an effort of futility. They would not have liked my explanations for leaving and only wanted to keep me around to suck more money out of me.
I wrote a letter of complaint to the top director of MetroTech School's, Dr Kara G. Wilson. In the letter I explained why I left and the current state of the school in my opinion. I received her reply on school letterhead, handwritten, all in capital letters, "GET A LIFE!". I hoped it had occurred
to her that I had been trying to get a life by enrolling in her school and putting up with her insufferable instructors for a year.
Total wasted expenditure about TEN GRAND and a year of my life.
I wrote letters to my State Representative, the Governor, The Oklahoma Board of Public Vocational Schools. I included copies of both my letter and her's.
They all shrugged their shoulders collectively. If OBPVS had done an investigation they would have surely found enough evidence to pull their accreditation on finding the low amount of students graduating from the program. I suspect payola is involved as a few minor administrators have had their personal aircraft repaired at the school by the instructors.
Oklahoma's tax dollars at work!
I wrote the Federal Aviation Administration to find out those exact numbers but met a bureaucratic wall. No one seemed to know what kind of statistics I wanted from them.
Shortly after starting my own personal investigation into the way MetroTech does business, asking a lot of biting questions, I received a call from the Oklahoma City Police Department asking me to stop "harassing" Dr. Wilson.
MetroTech employs a good number of OKCPD as security on all of their campuses. I can well imagine one of them being asked to intimidate me into silence. I must be nice to have your own "Goon Squad" on the payroll.
MetroTech Aviation Career Center continues on their merry way. I have a lifetime ban from the school for asking questions they didn't like and for complaining about the way they treat their clients.
Before you enroll at MetroTech or consider a career in aviation consider what I have said a warning!
[email protected]
..........................................
METRO TECH REBUTTAL - ..then, VICTIM RESPONDS BACK
Subj: Rebuttal to Report Metro Tech's Aviation Career Center
Date: 6/2/00 9:16:43 AM US Mountain Standard Time
From: [email protected] (Pete Lee)
To: [email protected]
The individual that expressed their displeasure with Metro Tech's Aviation Career Center has been at odds with Metro Tech for more than three years.
The source of discontent is that the individual had a personality conflict with two of the instructors that were and are on staff currently. According to memos and letters written to the site director at the time the only acceptable recourse was to fire the two instructors involved. When the Site Director would not accommodate the person stating the complaint, the Site
Director was then included in list of individuals that should be fired. This was further expanded to include all instructors on staff including those who had no contact with the individual.
The two instructors cited by the complainant have repeatedly been
complimented by their students for devotion to the profession and a genuine interest in the individual students. One of the instructors routinely has a class meet at his house during the weekend for cook outs and just "hanging out". The other instructor would remain three or four hours after class to
assist students in completing work projects or to provide individualized instruction.
The individual did take 30 classes of the Aviation Maintenance Technician program. The individual was absent for approximately 50 hours of instruction and must retake four courses. Fourteen other classes are incomplete for either missed time or incomplete work. It is probable that the inability to complete the required course work is what prompted the initial and
continuing displeasure by this person.
On several occasions the person lodging the complaint was offered an opportunity to express concerns and disagreements. At each juncture what was requested from the complainant was ever increasing and unacceptable demands.
Complaints were registered with the State Department of Vo Tech and it was inferred by the individual that legislative representatives were contacted.
The written communication from the individual was increasingly erratic and appeared to be disjointed. Review by District representatives and local law enforcement personnel determined that this individual was a jeopardy to public safety. For that reason the individual is not permitted on Metro Tech campuses. Arrangements were made with another training institution for the
individual to complete their training. As far as can be determined the individual has not availed themselves of the opportunity to complete the training.
Furthering this individual's aggravation was the unsubstantiated claim that the Aviation Industry was paying starting wages at the minimum wage level.
Four years ago when the purported layoff incident occurred, the Aerospace Industry was emerging from a significantly depressed market. Since that time demand for trained aircraft workers has increased and starting salaries are in the range of $10.00 to $12.00 per hour. Recruiters from across the nation are seeking licensed aircraft mechanics. Signing bonuses and moving expenses
are being offered to successful candidates.
Since the individual left the program in August 1997, 69 individuals have completed the AMT program and a majority of them are actively employed in the industry.
The Director and staff of Metro Tech's Aviation Career Center would invite anyone who has an interest in training to be an Aviation Maintenance Technician to visit in person the Aviation Career Center located at Will Rogers World Airport and meet with the staff. Arrangements could be made so a prospective student could ask current and former students about their opinion of the program.
VICTIM RESPONDS BACK TO REBUTTAL
.........................................
Subj: Consumer's Rebuttal to Metro Tech's
Aviation Career Center Rebuttal
Date: 6/2/00 1:37:59 PM US Mountain Standard Time
From: ExExpat93
To: [email protected]
I believe I covered all points in my first complaint and I did contact my state Representative, state Senator, the Governors Office, Oklahoma Department of Vocational Schools, and a public television program where citizens of this state are allowed to place questions to local government officials.
I work full-time unlike many students. I have to support myself and a family. The school is 5 days a week. Yes, I did miss a number of days while attending the school and had the opportunity to make up those days at the end of the course; in fact I could have made up those days while retaking the courses I had failed. I did as well as those that did not have full-time jobs so a good number of my fellow students could have retaken the subjects with me. I could get permission from some of the students to list their names to corroborate my account but at this time it is rather pointless. They list people who are working in the aviation field as those who enlist in the military after they leave the school. Ask them about those that enter the private sector and the number goes down considerably.
Glad to see they included their close relationship with law enforcement which they hire on their campuses. Everything would have been peachy if I hadn't stopped attending the school and complained about the school. They are only interested in the money.
I complained about the school because my complaints are justified. Yes, I did call for the dismal of some of the instructors to improve the course. I would have been satisfied if they had been given reprimands or notices to improve but I would not take another class with them as they would have been as highly displeased with me as I was with them. They have made no remedies to the situation and see no problem with the large numbers of students failing the amount of courses.
So, three years have passed. They are still wrong. I have a ban from the school. It is kind of hard to retake the courses if you are banned from the school and too much time has passed to pick up where I left off even if they made amends by reforming their course. I am still out time and effort by attending this shoddy excuse for a school.
Ask many students that have attended MetroTech Aviation Career Center; many are working in this community not in the aviation field. The wages in the aviation field are dismal even if you somehow complete this school.
Yes, Mr. Moreland does offer a pizza party when he gets student evaluations on his personal performance in class. Most of the after school time referred to graciously donated to students is usually in meetings with the director. I had no beef with Mr. Pate outside of his not instructing during the hands on aspect of the course.
If I was a great risk to "public safety" would I be using this form and appeals to my representatives in government to address my grievances about this school?
I join MetroTech in an invitation to attend the school if you are up for a very expensive lesson. I will leave that up to you decide if I am correct in my condemnation of this school.
4 Updates & Rebuttals
savannah
Graham,North Carolina,
WONDERFULL
#2REBUTTAL Owner of company
Wed, August 21, 2013
WOW...WHERE DO i START. THIS SCHOOL TOOK ME IN IN 1987 KNOWING I FLUNKED THE ENTRIS EXAM. BUT WORKED HARD AND OVER TIME (UNPAID) TO HELP ME THROUGH. i WAS HELL BENT ONGETTING THROUGH THIS AS A SINLE CHRISTIAN MONTHER WITH ONLY AN 8TH GRADE EDUCATION; AND WANTING AND BELEIVING THERE HAD TO BE MORE. THAT HAVEING BEEN SAID; MIKE THE AVIONICS INSTUCTOR YOU MENTIONED HAD ME REHEARSING AC FORMULAS IN MY SLEEP, CHRIS PHELPS CALLED ME IN THE GIRLS BATHROOM...3 MONTHS TO GO SAVANNAH DONT QUIT NOW....HE WAS RIGHT.
I TURNED DOWN AMERICAN AIRLINES TOOK MY JOB WITH McDONNELL DOUGLAS LONG BEACH BUILDNG THE FIST OF 5 C-17'S, AND COUNTLESS MD-11'S, MD-LL COMBI'S FOR ALITALLA. WORKING WITH PLANNER, ENGINEERS AND MAKING THINGS HAPPEN. YEP LAID OFF WENT TO FAA AS A CONTRACTOR, LAID OFF AGAIN. CAME TO NORTH CAROLINA WHERE I HAVE WORKED FOR TIMCO FOR 9 YEARS ON: 727 737 767 A320 DC9 MD11 AND REFUBISHED 5 DC10. THEN TO BOEING WHERE I WORKED THE 1ST THROUGH 5 OF THE T45 FIGHTER TRAINERS. AND THE LAST OF 15 HARRIERII REMANUFACTIORING WHERE I WAS ASK TO OVERSEE DELIVERY INSPECTIONS BY THE MARINES & NAVY. FROM THERE I WORKED AT FT.
BRAGG ON HELICOPTERS, OH-58, CH-47 SNOOKS THEN CONTRACTED WITH THE US COAST GUARD ON HH65 & H-60 BLACK HAWKS, & OPENED MY OWN LIL HANGER, (SILVER, BLUE & GOLD AVIATION SERVICES LLC) TO WORK FOR THE (SMALL FLYERS) ON CESSNA 150,172,185 SEAPLANES 421, MOONEY'S SKYMASTER, PIPERS GOT MY IA AND HAD IT NOT BEEN FOR MY HUSBANDS DIEING ON A C-130 AT THE COAST GUARD BASE, WE WOULD HAVE HAD IT MADE FOR THE REST OF OUR LIVES...PLAYING ON AIRPLANES.
SO DONT YOU DARE SAY WHAT THEY DIDNT DO FOR YOU! YOU DID'NT DO FOR YOUR SELF WHAT AN 8TH GRADER COULD. SHAME ON YOU! AND YOUR LOSS.
I DAERED TO DREAM; AND DAN , MIKE, CHRIS EVERYONE ON THAT STAFF; ALL SAID "DREAM"
Report Attachments
Sean
Jacksonville,Florida,
U.S.A.
Former Substitute Instructor's Response
#3UPDATE EX-employee responds
Mon, April 11, 2005
I worked at the Aviation Career Center during the timeframe the complaintant mentioned, as a substitute instructor, mostly in the airframe and powerplant sections. I'm also a graduate of MetroTech's Aviation Career Center, and a former student of Mike Moreland. (I no longer have any connection with MetroTech. I left there in 1998 when I received a promotion at my primary job and transferred to day shift. I did however substitute for two classes in 2001 for an apprenticeship class that my primary employer was conducting at the MTACC campus, but in this case I was paid by my primary employer, not MetroTech.) Mike is an excellent instructor who is extremely knowledgeable in aircraft electrical systems and installations, which is what he taught at the time. He was also the faculty sponsor for the VICA chapter, and I came to know him quite well. Mike does tend to be extremely focused, so much so that you sometimes have to really work to get through to get his attention. However, I have always found him to be an instructor who is constantly ready to repeat, as many times as necessary, the concepts he's trying to teach, and will vary his approach in trying to conveigh those concepts as needed. His quizzes and tests, though tough, were fair and covered all of the material he presented, and nothing more. He does teach at a very high level, and it's a real stretch for a lot of students, especially those who've been out of school for several years, or those who never did well in school in the first place. However, aircraft maintenance is not a good career choice for a lot of people. It's exacting--you MUST do the job the right way (that is, by the book) EVERY time. There's no place for creativity. The safety of the flying public, and the public in general, is at stake, and if a mechanic is of questionable ability (or especially integrity), it's best for everyone that they go to work in some other field. (Please understand that I am not trying to malign the complaintant. I don't know this person, so I cannot make any judgement as to their character. This person probably is a good, honest individual, and questions as to their integrity need not apply.) In any event, and though no one would confirm it, it has always seemed to me that MetroTech set up Mike Moreland's aircraft electricity class so as to be a filter--to eliminate those who do not have the dedication and drive to make it as aircraft mechanics. It's better to eliminate folks like this at as early a stage a possible, better for the school, for the individual, and for the industry. However, this 'filter' also tended to eliminate those who were already stretching their limits with a job and family. His course was tough--if you completed it, you could design an aircraft electrical system from scratch. In my class, in 1992, we students banded together to help each other study; some had a little background in the field, and were able to help the others. Some of those that were eliminated eventually came back and successfully completed the course. One guy had wrecked his car, and had to hitchhike nearly 90 miles, in the winter, to get to class and back home, and eventually dropped out. Another, who had had a number of run-ins with the law, dropped out but later got his life straightend out and also came back to pass Mike's class. I cannot comment on Mr. Pate. He came in after I had graduated, and I never substituted for his classes. I met him, but never really knew him (he passed away a few years ago). Similarly, I never knew Mr. Crawford; at the time I was working swing shift at my primary employer and had to leave before the evening classes started. Yes, a number of the instructors did tend to tell a lot of 'war stories', but anytime you get a bunch of aviation nuts together (and I assure you that nearly all aircraft mechanics are), they're going to start swapping stories. And some of the ones that MetroTech had were extraordinary. The father of one had been a mechanic for the Lafayette Escadrille in WWI; another had worked for Igor Sikorsky back in the early days of his company; another was there to see Wiley Post's first flights into the stratosphere. The depth and breadth of their experience increased, rather than decreased, the value of what they taught. As to the annual Aerospace America airshows (not 'Air America'), yes, MetroTech does play a part; it's (almost) always held on the airport where they're located--that is to say, in only one year since 1986 it was held elsewhere. There is some relocating and towing of aircraft involved, but since the airshow lasts only three days (at most), there's simply no way that the support operations could take up half the 18-month course. Personally, I feel that airshows such as these are a good thing for aircraft mechanics-in-training: you get to see examples of many of the things that you would only otherwise get to see in photographs or videos. And if you'll talk to the crews, they'll generally show you around their airplanes. Lastly, I've never seen a MetroTech concession stand at Aerospace America; they do have a booth, but it's just to try to attract new students, not sell drinks and hot dogs. The education I received at MetroTech was top-notch. It laid the foundation of my knowledge that has enabled me to succeed in the aviation maintenance industry. Another thing--if you don't LOVE aviation, don't become an aviation mechanic. The pay really isn't that great; experienced automotive and diesel mechanics make considerably more than experienced aircraft mechanics. The job often cycles from lots of overtime to barely 40 hours a week; you frequently have to work outside in all types of weather (except for thunderstorms), and in the middle of the night; you may be subject to being on-call on your days off; you generally get treated as if you're a brainless knuckle-dragger by the general public (think of Lowell on the sitcom Wings). Oh, and by the way, if the airplane you work on goes down, you can be held criminally liable (not to mention civil liability) if you made a mistake. (Now think back on how many times you've taken your car to a shop and they forgot to re-connect some vacuum hose or wire.) But if you're the right type of person, it can be a very rewarding field. MetroTech Aviation Career Center has been and still is a very good school for aircraft mechanics, and is an exceptional value. Private schools around the country frequently do not offer the number and range of hands-on projects that MetroTech does, and as a state-funded school, the tuition is less than half of the private schools that advertise in trade publications. Their financial aid folks are also top-notch. The criticism directed at this school, and specifically at Mike Moreland, is not justified. (BTW, my class started with 20 students, and 17 graduated upon completion of the course, which is an 85% graduation rate. Of those I've kept up with, only one (out of six) was unable to find a job in aviation--an 84% placement rate. I'd also like to point out that we graduated in 1994--near the bottom of a recession in the aviation industry.)
Ryan
Tulsa,Oklahoma,
U.S.A.
Although I did not obtain any type of certification I do feel that the money was well spent.
#4Consumer Comment
Sat, January 24, 2004
With regards to the "ripping off of Oklahomans". I attended Metro Tech about 5 or 6 years ago. Although I did not obtain any type of certification I do feel that the money was well spent. At the time of my attendance at Metro Tech, I was simply an immature teenager with thoughts other than the future. I look back now and wish that I had continued my education when it wasn't as hard as it is now. You see I learned the hard way that you have to WORK VERY HARD at everything that you do in life. Things don't just fall into your lap, especially life. I am currently working in the aviation field without an A&P certificate and currently trying to re-enroll in Metro Tech. You see it doesn't matter whether or not you like the teachers or if you like the the curriculum. What does matter is the effort that you put into your work. If you want something, then you should work as hard as you can to get it. If you do not obtain it, YOU DIDN'T WANT IT ENOUGH. I started working on reciprocating engines 4 years ago. I started out painting parts at $7.00 per hour, I now build, test run, and magnetic particle inspect engines at $12.00 per hour (you do the math). Although the money isn't the best in the world, it isn't bad for four years and no license. Imagine what you could do with one. The reason that I have done this well thus far is because I put an EFFORT into everything that I do, and will continue to do this until I am no longer able to. I too have a family and I too work full-time. That is no excuse to not obtain your goals. It is, however, an excuse to "GET A LIFE". Remember, you get out of life what you put into it. So, whatever it is you do in the future, just keep your mouth shut, work hard and stop making excuses for your downfalls. Perhaps then you will get somewhere in life.
DR David Flaherty
Oklahoma City,Oklahoma,
U.S.A.
Note to a "Lackie"
#5Consumer Comment
Sun, May 18, 2003
I have known Mike Morland for some time now and have the distinct pleasure of having him instruct me on several occasions in the aviation community. While it is true that Mr. Moreland has never worked as a mechanic, his knowledge and teaching style are awesome! He knows more about avionics and electricity than I do, and I have been in this buisness for over 20 years. I often question his comments and theories, and have even corrected him in the classroom enviroment, and his "anger" has never once surfaced. He is really very appreciative of the knowledge HE aquires from students on a daily basis. Always looking to learn! I do believe that you could not cut it in this industiy, and you were looking for a scapegoat to remove the focus from your own failure! Don't be bitter. Try the automotive field, the work is much easier and not nearly as mentally demanding. You should also contact your family doctor to see if Paxil is right for you! Regards,
